1. "Pillow Shams"
Posted by haulover on Jul-28th-03 at 10:35 PM

from Hyde in witness statements:

"In talking to Bridget Sullivan on the above date (August 4, 1892) I asked her what time Mrs. Borden went upstairs.  She said she thought it was a little before nine o'clock in the morning; and sometime after she came down for some pillow shams.  And she said to me, "have you anything particular to do?" Bridget answered "no mam." Mrs. Borden said "I would like you to wash those windows."  I went out and washed the windows and never saw Mrs. Borden again alive."

in testimony, i can't find bridget saying anything about the pillow shams.  that seems to be lizzie's story.  but reading this, i wonder if lizzie ever had any conversation whatsoever with abby -- but overheard one between bridget and abby and used a part of it to make her own story.

I noticed also that that was Bridget's only reference to her knowledge that Abby would be in the guest room, or had been there.
I was wondering the opposite!
That Bridget overheard Lizzie and Abby!
HUH!  That's interesting.
Listen, I'm beginning to wonder about Hyde.  How reliable do we rate him?  What do you think?
(He's becoming irritating with info, or interpretation of info that doesn't quite fit-- I don't know what else to call it)

--Anyway, if Lizzie & Abby did have that whole huge conversation (I thought they didn't speak?) about the wrappers and the meat and the note and she's going out and oh by the way I'm available in the guest room for the next few minutes to be assaulted and murdered...that would use up some time that would account for a later death time than 9 on the dot.  The conversation with Lizzie in the dining room might have stretched til 9:10 or so...  Which would fit a compromise time-line.
Do we know which girl was last to supposedly talk to Abby in the dining room?  That is something I haven't figured out.

lizzie and bridget overlap or conflict or are just blurred at this critical point in time, the time of abby's murder.  i've contemplated how strange this is -- that such a short amount of time holds the answer, lack of info, no other witnesss, and odd descrepancies.

the only other partial witness that morning is morse.  i'm going to read him more tonight before i go to bed.  i did notice today in trial testimony, he says he was aware of abby going into the front part of the house (to go upstairs to make bed?) before he left, which would be about 8:45? 

From my Post 3 on JVM's dirty laundry --

In the trial, JVM sez Abby disappeared into the front hallway while he
was talking to Andrew in the sitting room.  Would have been sometime before 8:40-8:45 (the time he gives for leaving).  That leaves her free to be upstairs, in the parlor, dining room, kitchen...practically anywhere in the house without him seeing her pass.

JVM also seems to contradict Bridget, as he said he heard Abby give the instructions for window washing...while Bridget seems to indicate that was closer to 9 AM (after JVM claimed to have been gone 15-20 mins).  This is the last time Bridget claims to have seen Abby.

If Abby didn't die until around 9:30, that gives her close to an hour to have changed the bed linens.

Morse just confuses things further!

With Andrew's murder the timeline seems a bit easier to work with, with Abby's its downright confusing.  Lizzie has all sorts of things happening at this point in time according to her testimony.  This is what I could gather from looking at all the different source documents I have, bear with me, I'm trying to make a timeline to fit all that is supposed to have happened that morning:

-8:40 or 8:45 AM; John Morse leaves Borden house 20 or 15 minutes before 9:00 AM, so its 8:40 or 8:45 AM.  He last saw Abby alive 10 minutes before he left, around 8:30 to 8:35 AM.

-8:41 or 8:46 AM; Bridget says Abby went up to the guest room a little before 9:00 AM.  (Abby perhaps waits until Morse leaves to go up there?) So, perhaps she went up at 8:41 or 8:46 AM.

-8:42 or 8:47 AM; Lizzie leaves her room after Morse leaves (perhaps waiting until she is sure he is gone?) and sees Abby in guest room around 9:00.  Must be more like 8:42 or 8:47 AM.

-8:43 or 8:48 to 8:45 or 8:50 AM; Before Lizzie comes down hears Andrew at front door around 9:00 speaking to man who wants to hire store, speaks English, Andrew sends him away.  (Perhaps Lizzie loiters on stairs if this is to be believed, waits until Andrew leaves front hall?)

-8:45 or 8:50 AM; Lizzie says she came down quarter to nine, sees Andrew in sitting room reading paper, gives him letter to mail to Emma, perhaps has brief conversation.

-8:48 or 8:53 AM; Lizzie enters kitchen, tells Bridget that she doesn't want any breakfast, will have coffee and cookies, sets down slop pail.

-8:50 or 8:55 AM; Lizzie is seated at kitchen table having coffee and cookies, Bridget runs out to vomit, she says 10 to 5 minutes after John Morse left.

-8:51 or 8:56 AM; Abby comes downstairs and answers front door, gets anonymous note for someone who is sick, she has come down for pillow shams according to Bridget for pillows on foot of bed.

-8:52 or 8:57 AM; Lizzie says Andrew comes into kitchen and says he might not go to the post office afterall.  Abby goes up to her room for pillow cases for guest room bed and comes back down?

-9:02 or 9:07 AM; Bridget comes back into house after being sick for 10 to 15 minutes, does not see Lizzie in kitchen anymore.  Lizzie has possibly let Andrew out side or front door and gone into dining room at this point and sees Abby dusting, has conversation with her about dinner, note to see someone sick, pillow cases, etc.  Bridget says Abby started dusting the dining room and sitting room about 15 minutes or so after Lizzie got up.

-9:12 or 9:17 AM; Bridget has washed her dishes and brings them in to set up the dining room table again.  Bridget says she saw Abby about 9:00 AM in dining room dusting, knows Andrew is gone at this point.  Lizzie states Andrew must have left after 9:00 AM.  Abby tells Bridget to wash the windows, inside and out, Bridget never sees her alive again.  (Lizzie at this point may be in sitting room reading paper, or eavesdropping?)

-9:15 or 9:20 AM; Bridget goes to kitchen and starts puttering with stove and putting things away. Abby perhaps has gone on to dust the sitting room.  Lizzie leaves sitting room, possibly goes up to her room or has snuck down to the cellar?

-9:23 or 9:28 AM; Bridget leaves kitchen and goes into dining room and sitting room to shut windows and then goes to gather her window washing tools.  Goes out to barn for pole, perhaps Lizzie comes down from room and goes to cellar for hatchet?

-9:28 or 9:33 AM; Bridget is just coming back from barn to side door when Lizzie suddenly appears at screen door.  Has conversation about washing windows and no need to lock the door unless you want to.

-9:31 or 9:36 AM; Lizzie goes upstairs as per her testimony that she went directly upstairs with her clean clothes after her trip to the water closet.  Andrew is seen downtown at the Union Saving Bank by Everett Cook, Mr. Cook says he saw Andrew about half past 9.

-9:35 or 9:40 AM; Lizzie begins to kill Abby or is basting a loop on a garment that takes only 5 minutes.

-9:38 or 9:43 AM; Bridget finishes chat with the Kelly's girl and proceeds to wash windows starting with the sitting room.  Perhaps allowing 30 seconds per pane, 12 panes per window, 7 windows washed; 42 minutes? 

-10:10 or 10:15 AM; Bridget goes into kitchen to get dipper to rinse the windows.  Lizzie possibly getting cleaned up and changing dress at this point in time.  Bridget goes back out and proceeds to rinse windows, somewhere along this time Mrs. Churchill sees Bridget rinsing 1 parlor window.

-10:30 or 10:35 AM: Bridget comes in and gets handbasin and goes into sitting room to wash insides of windows, gets upper half of 1 window done when she hears Andrew at front door trying to get in.  Bridget states that it was later than half past 10.

Then we get into Andrew's timeline.  Thats the best I could do to try and fit all of what was supposed to happen around and about 9:00 AM.   

I was just getting into this timeline when I got kicked off the Internet last night from 4:30 a.m. or so until now.

I think it's really good.  I know it must have taken a lot of time.
Thanks for doing that.

We can't debate this tho without some sources.  I hope that's possible.

Yes, entirely possible.  All from the Inquest, Witness Statement's, Preliminary and Trial.  You may debate away, but, be gentle!  As I said, I'm trying to fit it what each person said happened around what time, an awful lot of things happened about 9:00! 

Could it be that WSB was in hiding, but after Abby left the guest room he then went in to hide? "You hide best if you move around a lot" said the expert S. Hussein. (Yes, Kat, I made it up!)

Good for you, Susan!  I started working on a Lizzie/Bridget summary of that time period using just their testimonies and was beginning an attempt to sort out the contradictions.  You've given us a good framework to work with. 

Thanks, Diana.  Yes, there are plenty of contradictions between Lizzie and Bridget's testimony.  One of the ones that hit me right at the start is Lizzie states that she went to the water closet 3 minutes or so upon arising.  If we go by her testimony, Abby is up in the guest room, Andrew in sitting room.  She talks with Andrew, says she talks with Abby in dining room, thats more than 3 minutes.  Bridget doesn't say anything about Lizzie immediately going down cellar, but, that Lizzie has her breakfast.  I tried to fit these things in, in a way that made some sense, its still rough, needs work. 

that's a good effort, susan, and i appreciate it.  i started working with it tonight, but i had some long emails to compose.  i don't want your effort to go wasted, but i need to read some more and check for descrepencies, for example, among mr. morse's various statements.

ray, do you think that the position of abby's dead body supports the theory that she met up with an axe weilding madman in that guest room?

it looks more like she was on her knees trying to clean something when someone came in on her.

did brown deal with this sort of detail?

I don't think it needs work.  I think it needs each fact referenced to the source.
You did explain that you used cardinal sources.
What I mean is all mixed together from many sources I would love to see from which each fact came.  Personally I need that.  I don't think I can run with it without that..

First, "turning your back" on somebody IS a mild insult.
Very dangerous to do to an enraged lunatic!
I wasn't there w/ videotape, but something said had to create rage and anger. QED.

Since nobody confessed, we must be able to deduce (or speculate) on how this happened.
Ever been in a bar brawl? Does it result from some guy complimenting another? Or from "fighting words"?

well, i suppose abby could have said, "now get out of this house" and then turned her back.  but i'm inclined to think she would want to "see him out" in that case?

Okay, Kat, heres where the different info came from:

-Morse's time for leaving Borden house; Witness Statements and Morse's Inquest testimony.

-Abby going up to guest room about 9; Bridget in Witness Statements, Joseph Hyde.

-Lizzie leaves room and sees Abby in guest room about 9; Lizzie in Witness Statements, Fleet.

-Man comes for Andrew to talk about store about 9; Lizzie in Witness Statements, Fleet.

-Lizzie coming down before 9 and seeing Andrew in sitting room and giving him letter to Emma to mail; Lizzie's Inquest testimony.

-Lizzie having breakfast and Bridget goes out to vomit 10 to 5 minutes after Morse leaves; Bridget in Preliminary.

-Abby getting note from someone; Lizzie's Inquest testimony.  Abby coming down for pillow shams some time after she had gone up to guest room; Bridget in Witness Statements, Joseph Hyde.

-Lizzie says Andrew comes into kitchen, says might not go to post office; Lizzie's Inquest testimony.  Abby getting pillow cases, my supposition here as this is the reason she came down from the guest room.

-Bridget comes back into kitchen 10 to 15 minutes later, doesn't see Lizzie there; Bridget Preliminary.  Lizzie letting Andrew out, my thought.  Lizzie sees Abby dusting in dining room has conversation with her; Lizzie's Inquest.  Abby starts dusting dining room and sitting room 15 minutes after Lizzie gets up; Bridget's Trial testimony.

-Bridget washes her breakfast dishes, whats left of them and brings them into dining room to set up; Bridget in Preliminary and Bridget's Trial testimony.  Abby in dining room dusting, tells Bridget to wash the windows, Bridget Trial.  Lizzie saying Andrew left after nine; Lizzie's Inquest.

-Bridget cleans stove up and puts things away; Bridget in Preliminary.  Rest is my thought.

-Bridget closes windows and starts collecting cleaning gear; Bridget in Preliminary.

-Bridget at side door and Lizzie suddenly appears and has conversation with her; Bridget in Preliminary.

-Lizzie goes straight upstairs to her room with her clean clothes after her trip to the cellar; Lizzie's Inquest.  Andrew sighted downtown, I might have mixed this one up, but, he was seen at half past nine; Witness Statements, William Medley.

-Lizzie bastes loop on garment; Lizzie's Inquest.

-Bridget chats with the Kelly girl before cleaning windows; Bridget in Preliminary.  Amount of windows; Bridget Preliminary.

-Bridget goes back into house for dipper to rinse windows with after she has scrubbed them; Bridget in Preliminary.  Mrs. Churchill sees Bridget rinse one parlor window; Mrs. Churchill in Preliminary.

-Bridget comes into house and gathers things and goes to sitting room to wash inside windows and only gets upper half of one done before Andrew is fumbling at the front door; Bridget in Preliminary.  Bridgets statement as to the time Andrew got home; Witness Statements.

Hope that helps?  Was going to post it last night, but, had to go back and decipher my notes, yikes! 

I know how long this sort of thing takes and I thank you.
This stuff can take days.
I thought you might edit the original and just add [Inq.63]  or [Prelim.72], etc.
This is like you did the work twice and I didn't mean for you to have to do that, sorry.
--" 'Lizzie leaves room and sees Abby in guest room about 9"; Lizzie in Witness Statements, Fleet.'
Here is a debatable point tho it is Fleet:

"Saw Lizzie 2 hours later, wanted to search her room, Dr. Bowen was in.  She did not want to be bothered, would make her sick, told her that I must search on account of the murders, otherwise should not be doing my duty, She then allowed the search to go on.  Could not find anything in the room which would show blood and found no Instruments that had been used for murder.  She said that it was impossible for any o: to get in or throw anything in her room because she always kept it locked.  Lizzie said that she had not seen Mrs. Borden since about 9 o'clock She thought _____Bedroom when she was _______."

This is the original notation.  See Privy, page 4, " 'Original' Version of First Witness Statements".
Looking at Lizzie's Inquest I can't find where she says she saw Abby in that room when she Lizzie came down.  The closest she comes is pg. 63:
Q. Did she say anything about making the bed?
A. She said she had been up and made the bed up fresh, and had dusted the room and left it all in order. She was going to put some fresh pillow slips on the small pillows at the foot of the bed, and was going to close the room, because she was going to have company Monday and she wanted everything in order.
Q. How long would it take to put on the pillow slips?
A. About two minutes.
Q. How long to do the rest of the things?
A. She had done that when I came down.
Q. All that was left was what?
A. To put on the pillow slips.

--This sounds like someone filled in those blanks that Lizzie actually saw Abby in that room.  She didn't say that, that I can find.
Lizzie either inferred it from what she says she was told by Abby, Lizzie may have heard her in there working while she was in her own room, or just possibly she saw the room was made up when she, Lizzie came down the first time.

--This is not debating you, this is clarifying statements and timing.

Thanks for clarifying that, Kat.  So, basically what I'm left with there is just a deduction from Bridget's testimony and Lizzie's.  From the times given by each, from when Abby was supposed to have gone to guest room, Andrew had a possible tenant come to the door and when Lizzie said she came down, to when Bridget said she came down.  It might not be a given fact, but, I'm trying to piece the puzzle together with the info we have, which is a tangled mess for the murder of Abby.  I think together we'll get this thing figured out yet! 

susan, i hope so.  here's a suggestion in working with this.  questions about everybody else when focusing on one person's actions.

where was everybody during the time that bridget was eating her breakfast in the dining room?

i pick that question only because it's not such a typical one.  but certainly bridget was alone in the room.  and people were not passing through?

Yes, that was where my mind was at when I did the timeline, Lizzie wasn't seen for certain periods of time and suddenly appeared, where was she?

As for where everyone was while Bridget ate her breakfast, I believe Andrew, Abby and John were in the sitting room, Lizzie up in her bedroom.  Kind of gross, actually, that part always makes it sound to me like Bridget is eating whatever pickings were left in everyone's plates, I know its not the case, but, thats what I think. 

We have Mrs. Churchill seeing Andrew outside by the steps at about 9 a.m.(Prelim., 275) as eyewitness, but no proof that any *man* came to the door about 9.
I wonder what Andrew was doing loitering by the steps at that time, which seems just about the time of his possible departure.  He also can't be answering the front door at 9 if he is out the side yard.
She then says she saw him heading toward the street but stopped looking.  It implies he came from the barn or yard area because he was standing still at the east side of the steps.
I wonder if he had come from the barn and was stopping at the steps, deciding if he would go downtown?  Maybe he had been to that *necessary*, as he had been sick.

Or maybe, my speculation here, Bridget was in the yard being sick about that time and Andrew was hovering back and forth outside that side door because it was unlocked and no one was watching it.  Andrew sees Bridget being sick, maybe wants to make sure she is okay?  Wants to know how long she'll be out there with the screen door unhooked, thinks the better of it and leaves.  Bridget never sees him.  Hmmmm? 

Q.  After the breakfast was completed do you know where those three went or either of them?
A.  Well, I guess they must go in the sitting-room. The bell rang, and when I went in there was nobody in the dining-room.
Q.  The bell from the table, do you mean?
A.  Yes, sir.
Q.  Indicating that the breakfast had been completed?
A.  Yes, sir.
Q.  And they had gone from the dining-room at that time?
A.  Yes, sir.
Q.  What did you do then?
A.  I sat down and had my breakfast.
Q.  Did you have your breakfast in the dining-room?
A.  Yes, sir." (Bridget, Trial)


So Bridget thought the three were in the sitting-room while she ate. 

But here's a bit in Rebello’s time-line that I'd like to source. He says: "After Mrs. Borden rang the bell, signifying they were finished with their breakfast, Bridget sat down at the dining room table with her back to the sitting room where Mr. Borden sat and usually had his breakfast.” (Rebello, 572,573)

Rebello references it as Trial pages 222-226 -- but I can't find the part that says she sat in Andrew's chair. 

Not a huge issue -- but I've puzzled over it.

---










(Message last edited Aug-2nd-03  5:45 PM.)

I read the pages 222-226 and could not find anything either.

He seems to be saying she sat on the south side of the table facing north and that's where Mr. Borden sat when eating his breakfast.

Do you read that the same way?  If that's so she would not be able to see into the kitchen or sitting room assuming both doors were open. But I can't see any importance to that, at least during that period of time she was eating.

That would be cool though if Bridget sat in Andrew's chair every day to eat her breakfast.

Rebello is right.  From Trial pg. 276:

Q. You had your breakfast in the dining room?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. What part of the dining room did you sit?
A. I sat at the table.
Q. Which side?
A. The south side, towards Dr. Kelley's.
Q. You sat on the south side of the dining room?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And your back was towards the sitting room?
A. My back was towards the sitting room.
Q. You sat on the side of the table?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Whose place was that, ordinarily?
A. Mr. Borden's.
Q. That was where Mr. Borden ordinarily sat, with his back to the sitting room wall?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. And his face would be looking over towards Mrs. Churchill's?

That's great you guys.
And now I know why Susan had the idea that Bridget ate the family's leftovers the way that sentence is worded!

:  ...that Bridget sat down,,"where Mr. Borden sat and usually had his breakfast.” (Rebello, 572,573)

I too picture Bridget gobbeling up what Andrew left on his plate!! 

I also have always loved that picture of Bridget taking the Master's chair.

Thank you, haulover!  That has been nagging at me for a long time.   

Now that makes me wonder about the usual seating arrangements in the dining room.  Would the spot Andrew sat be considered the head of the table and would Abby sit across from him on the Churchill side of the house?  Or, did everyone sit where they were most comfortable?  If it was me, I would want to sit on the Churchill side facing the 2 doors into the dining room.  I do love that though, Bridget taking over the master's chair while he is away.