1. "I want these windows washed"
Posted by Harry on Mar-5th-04 at 8:36 PM

I was just reading Bridget's trial testimony and her descriptions on the washing of the windows.

Looking at a floor plan of the first floor, there are 12 windows in all. 3 in the kitchen, 1 in the sink room, 1 in the pantry, 2 each in the dining and sitting rooms and 3 in the parlor.

Bridget did not wash any of the kitchen, pantry or sink room windows on the inside or the outside.

The 3 parlor windows were washed only on the outside.

Only the sitting room and dining room windows were washed inside and outside.

So only 7 of the 12 received some sort of washing and only 4 of those 7 a complete washing.

Why not the kitchen windows and would not they be among the dirtiest being nearest to the fumes and smoke from the stove? 

Hmmmmmm. Maybe it's not about the dirt.

--Lyddie

I've thought of that too, Harry.  And her method of rinsing is laughable - throwing a dipperful of water at the window.  Go outside to one of your windows and rinse one like that and see what it looks like.  Crap - that's what. 

For all we know, Mrs. Borden never told Bridget to wash any windows that day at all.  We only have Bridget's word on that.  Maybe Lizzie said so, too, but we don't have Mrs. Borden's testimony to back that up.  Maybe Lizzie told Bridget to go out and make a show of it. 

It could have been the ones Bridget "washed" were the only ones that were really that dirty.  But I agree with you - the inside kitchen window must have been pretty bad from the woodstove. 

If she had been sick and throwing up she may have just given them a lick and a promise...

Maybe she knew Abby had bought the farm and didn't care what type of job she did.......

HMMMMMM.....I have often wondered why Aby wanted the windows washed that particular day--a day on which the entire household was ill to varying degrees. Given that Bridget had puked her guts out a short time before starting the task I don't think she would have cared what kind of job she did on them regardless of whether Abby was alive, dead, or kidnapped by Martians. 

Those who believe that Bridget was the suspect in the murders often point to Abby's ordering her to do the windows on a hot day while violently ill as the motive.

(Message last edited Mar-6th-04  2:31 AM.)

Harry,
"So only 7 of the 12 received some sort of washing and only 4 of those 7 a complete washing."

Augusta,
"Maybe Lizzie told Bridget to go out and make a show of it." 

Lyddie,
"Hmmmmmm. Maybe it's not about the dirt."

Audrey,
"Maybe she knew Abby had bought the farm and didn't care what type of job she did......."

Me thinks you may be onto something here!
On a hundred degree day it would not be an activity I would expect even a really mean employer to require. It has always seemed to me that the window washing was covering something up. Could it have been Bridget, being the good Irish girl she was, couldn't take the inside cleanup and was sent out to do the windows to distract from any motion taking place in the house? Abby telling her to do it is not provable any more than any suppositions on our part now.

Gramma

Interestingly enough, the Whiteheads were washing windows that day too.  Little Abby recalls her mothers dropping the open window on her little hand upon receiving news of the Borden murders.  (Can't recall source right off, but I could look it up when I have more time.) Also, they were actually getting a break in the weather.  Remember the heat wave was the previous week, and the temp was in the 70's that morning.

--Lyddie

What is the source of this?
"Remember the heat wave was the previous week, and the temp was in the 70's that morning."
If it is true then there was another deliberate attempt to change the picture.

"A Private Disgrace" by Victoria Lincoln   page 76
"August 4, 1892, was hot even at dawn; it became the hottest day in memory for all who lived in a town remarkable for its summer heat."

Gramma

The high temperatures are probably the biggest myth of the Borden legend. It certainly was not the hottest day of the year nor in memory.  It never hit anywhere near 100 degrees. 

This from an article in the LBQ, January 1997, page 7 by William L. Masterton:

1)  The Fall River Daily Herald ... quoted temperatures of 74 at 8am and 80 at noon.  Interpolation gives 78 at 11am.

2)  The Fall River Evening News ... "Remington and Davol's thermometer (in Fall River) registered 79 at 11am.

3)  The United States Signal Service ... gave Fall River temperatures of 67 at 7am and 83 at 2pm.

Masterton draws the conclusion that when Andrew Borden was killed (11am) it was 78 plus or minus 2 degrees.

This is hardly a heat wave.

A similar article was  written by our own William Schley Ulrich in that same issue.  And Bill's conclusion was that the temperature was even lower than Masterton's conclusion. I'll let Bill speak for himself.

after reading and hearing about the true temps on the day of the murders some time ago, I concluded (in my own humble mind) that the heat wave and the murders occurred ABOUT the same time so many confused the two as being together.


It does surprise me.... I live in an area where it can be 100f and if it is and it drops to even the relatively hot 80f we comment on it and enjoy the "milder" temp of 80!

Not only that-- But it had puzzled me (before hearing the accurate temps) that the officer first on the scene and Brigitte were tearing about pell-mell at the originally thought temp!


(Message last edited Mar-6th-04  4:28 PM.)

Harry this temp thing has always bugged me too, so many writers
report about the sweltering hot day.  What you quote from Rebello
may not be the definite answer.  Say the actual temp was 80 but the
humidity was a bigger factor.  It might have felt like 100.  Funny
the actual cast of characters didn't remark on the weather though.

Nancie, what I cited is from an article by Masterton in the LBQ, not Rebello.

Using the heat index at

http://www.nsdl.arm.gov/Education/Java/HeatIndex/heatindex.html

a temperature of 78 degrees with a humidity factor of 90% would only make the body feel like it was 80.49 degrees.

Yes, it was a warm morning but over-bearingly hot, I don't think so.

where did you get the humidity factor for that day?

No one knows what the humidity was for that day.  I just used 90, a very high number.

We also have the curious enigma of Morse's testimony that he heard Abby instruct Bridget to wash the windows during the Borden's breakfast early Thursday morning.
Did the 3 not get their stories straight?

Lil' Abby's mother was at Rockly Point and I believe the girl was at her aunt's- & Who was neighbor to Hilliard?

Here it is in Sullivan's book :" Goodbye Lizzie Borden"

" ...Sarah Whitehead was hale and hearty and was, in fact, that day on the sail to Rocky Point to attend the police clambake, about which so much has been written. All in all, it is incredible that a thorough examination of the total transcript reveals that Sarah Whitehead was never called to the witness stand by the prosecution. A distressing footnote was supplied by Mrs. Abby Potter, who told me:

'On the morning of 4 August, the day of the murders, my mother  [Mrs. Sarah Whitehead],  planning to attend the policemen's annual picnic at Rocky Point, was making arrangements for the care of my younger brother and myself. George was to go to [another aunt's house], and I was to spend the day with Aunt Abby at 92 Second Street. At the last moment there was a change in plans, and I was sent with my brother to [my other aunt's] house, which was next door to the home of Marshal Hilliard in another section of Fall River.

'In the late afternoon while I was helping Aunt Lucy wash windows, Marshal
Hilliard returned home, and, standing in the yard, informed Aunt Lucy of Aunt Abby's murder. The shock of the news was so great that Aunt Lucy dropped the window on my hand.' "

--Caveat:  'Lil Abby's recollections came 80 years after this possible incident.



(Message last edited Mar-7th-04  1:46 AM.)

In the January issue of the LBQ, pg. 7, in the article by Masterton he finds that "...The National Weather Bureau...did not publish temperature data for Fall River.  They did, however, give daily temperaturesa for July and August, 1892, in Boston....Clearly there were two heat waves that summer, centered around July 26 and August 10.  In contrast, the temperature was close to normal in New England during the week of August 4."

--He also provides a graph to show the temperature fluctuations.

(Message last edited Mar-7th-04  2:13 AM.)

AND I always wondered why Bridget would grab her shawl on the way out, as she says she did.  I do wonder if the house heated up in the course of the day, with all the people milling about.  We all know how hot cramped, crowded rooms can get.

--Lyddie

It turns out Bridget did not take a shawl to hurriedly cross the street to neighbor and family friend Bowen.
But she did take a shawl to go for Alice, farther away.
That was more the custom.
One might even drape the shawl upon the head if society dictates the head should always be covered while out,( even servants?)

Actually, when I am in a run-around dress I too take a shawl.

I think the shawl fits the "purse factor" most women have today.

I took my purse when leaving for the hospital to give birth.  It is a force of habit. 

I think you would grab the shawl on a day such as August 4 was.  My point was that if it had been so stifling as it was always said to be, she would be inclined to omit, or merely carry the shawl.  When I was little, women never left the house without white gloves, but during horrible heat waves they would carry them sometimes, unworn.

--Lyddie

I understand.
My point was if any woman was going anywhere at any season she was expected to wear a hat.
A shawl would be considered decent covering of a work dress and could also be substituted for a hat.
In the first moment of crisis, and just across the street, Bridget didn't think of it.
She showed decorum when she did take the shawl, the second time out.

Andrew wore his Prince Albert coat out downtown in August and Lizzie wore a hat just to go to the barn, according to her...

Audrey, I recognize that "a lick and prayer" from Victoria Lincoln's book!

I've been in modern-day Fall River, in early August, on a sunny, humid 82 degree day, and it was icky.

I don't see anything bizarre about Bridget was using a brush to clean the windows outside, and then rinsing them by tossing up dippers-full of clean water.  The windows might've been covered with the soot and horse-dung powder of that industrial town, and I doubt Bridget was required to hand-polish the outside panes to a streakless shine!

Wasn't it customary in those days for a decent woman to cover her head on the street?  I have my doubts about the whole "Lizzie wore one to the barn," though.  I think it was, as Lincoln suggested, part of her aborted attempt to go out and establish an alibi for Abby's death, short-circuited by Andrew's arrival.  

(Message last edited Mar-8th-04  4:35 PM.)

Bob, will you check your letterbox for mail?

Perhaps an uncovered head, like patent leather shoes or swinging a purse, advertised "a woman of the streets" (another euphemism).

There were laws against soliciting, but not against a man who asks?

Kat, I did - sorry! Thanks!

Raymond, I don't think we need to so far as to posit that an unhatted woman was identifying herself as a lady of easy virtue; it simply wasn't socially correct to traipse about bare-headed - this continued for years, into the twentieth century.

Yes, even prostitutes had hats!
Recall how poignant it was that a new-hatted woman of the streets of the East End, London, was found butchered?

I believe it was de rigeur for a woman - especially when dressing up - to wear some sort of head wear in public up until the mid 1960s, although the custom had began to die out around the '50s. It is still the custom among the British aristocracy and the Royal Family.

Oh my God! 150 posts!! WHOO-HOO!!!

(Sorry, got a little excited there..  )

(Message last edited Mar-8th-04  6:06 PM.)

Yes, I'm sure you're right about that. An unhatted woman or man would certainly attract attention in those days. But would that also rule out just carrying a hat? I once read that bleaching dark hair blonde  used to be a sign of availability in olden days. I could be mistaken.

One thing that comes to my mind about Bridget's shawl is that it is never described at to what kind it was.  After doing a search, there seems to be many different materials that were used as shawls, I personally always pictured her with something that was hand knitted or crocheted.  But, there seems to be a variety of materials that were available that were used as shawls from wool, to paisly, to lace, so, in reality it could have been any type of material.

I did find this tidbit of info on shawls and lower class English women, perhaps this is where Bridget's practice came from?

Working women in the industrial towns of northwest England wore shawls long after they had ceased to be fashionable (after 1870); and they wore them pinned under their chins-both for warmth and as a substitute for the necessary hat or bonnet.

From this site:http://www.corsets.de/node71.html

We're really not having a discussion about 19th century prostitutes and their methods, unless you want to start another thread, Raymond.

Wearing a "shawl" (a cloth head covering) was a sign of poverty: too poor to own a proper hat. Have we forgotten life in "the good old days"?

For those who are wondering about the fashions in 1892 and what Lizzie may  have worn take a look!
http://www.calicoannie.net/1800's.htm

If you scroll down you will find they named the 1890's dresses as Lizzie A, B, C and D! How cute! They do look to be true to the times though and on the same page is a shawl and a capelet so you can see what they look like, too.
Have fun!

Gramma

How sweet!  I enjoyed that page, G.!

Notice these are 2 piece outfits. Here is an outfit of Lizzie's which is on display at #92 Second Street.

Thanks, Kat, thats so cool, something that actually touched Lizzie!  Do they give a year for the garments and how they were authenticated?  To me it looks to be early 1900s, love that skirt, very pretty. 

It was given to the Ernest Terry family from Lizbeth.  He was her chauffeur.  It is on loan from his grandchild.
I'd say it was about a size 4 or 6.
It is very pretty.

That blouse is a classic--- I think several of us may have one that looks somewhat like it! 

That skirt is lovely too. 

Lizzie did have good taste in clothing.  It is almost as she knew the adage of buying a classic rather than a trend.

Looking at that blouse and skirt I can almost imagine some circumstances where that very outfit would work today!

It is in fabulous condition...

Cool site, Susan!

--Lyddie

Size 4 or 6! Not at all the Amazon who could bench press an aircraft carrier!  Those sleeves could never encase muscles like those.  I think the leg of mutton sleeves seen in the porch picture created an unfortunate illusion of size.  This ensemble is clearly that of a petite woman.

--Lyddie

Is the mannequin which Lizzie's dress is on the the same height as Lizzie?  I noticed the dress touched the floor.  Lizzie, according to, I believe the dressmaker, was reported to wear her dresses long.

I was just wondering if that was about how much normally touched the ground. 

During my first stay at the house, I too enjoyed the display of Lizziewear.  The small size really had me thinking...could someone this tiny and seemingly delicate have wailed on someone's head 18-19 times from a standing position, and then to have another go at it with someone else's head aproximately 90 minutes or so later ?  I have to really wonder about that.  One of Lizzies dresses was in Lizzie's room with me.  "It" was on the dress form...at the end of the bed...so that when the moonlight came in through the window, I could really imagine Lizzie herself standing there.  It added great ambiance and wasn't even scary.  Maybe I should try sleeping on the floor of the guest room when I make my second trip this April...what do you think ?

I think, since it ends with a neck, it's hard to tell.  That's a good question tho about the height.
Emma said Lizzie's Bedford Cord was longer than her usual indoor dresses and had a length like a train of an outdoor dress.
I guess her outdoor dresses were long enough to sweep the pavement.
This looks like a light summer outfit but imagine the corset and knickers and petticoats under that!

I just found this illustration and it reminded me of the Lizzie outfit on display at the B&B.  While the blouse is frillier, I think it gives the general idea of how Lizzie may have looked in it. 



Illustration is from this site: http://www.geocities.com/victorianlace18/resorts.html

Hmmm, it looks like the picture didn't take, here it is again.



(Message last edited Mar-12th-04  5:01 PM.)

thats a great pic Susan, Lizzie on the boardwalk at the Joisey Shore!

Yes that looks right!  Adding all the petticoats and such really expands the skirt!

Hey Stuart!
Here is Saratoga Springs 1880.

Thanks, NJ, yes, I thought that too, on the boardwalk in Atlantic City. 

Kat, not to mention that that skirt is so sheer, you would definitely need a petticoat under there to hide your limbs.  It would be great if they had the accessories that went with that outfit, the gloves and hat, really give you a taste of Lizzie's style. 

The 2 outfits were predominately PINK!

(Message last edited Mar-15th-04  11:02 PM.)

Hmmmm.  So, do you think its safe to say that besides blue, pink was Lizzie's other favorite color?  There was that pink and white stripe wrapper where pink was the predominant color.  Theres the outfit that you and Stefani photographed.  You say 2 outfits, was there another in the house?  I think this would be an interesting little find; Lizzie liked to dress in pink and blue, almost sounds like baby colors. 

Does blue and pink go with auburn hair? The first, yes. The second only for indoor home wear. But I could be wrong about fashion then.