The Lizzie Borden Society archive

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1. "Lizzie Borden Loved Animals"
Posted by adminlizzieborden on Jan-8th-02 at 9:06 PM

By raystephanson on Sunday, 12/30/2001 - 03:18 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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Did she own a collie called "Lassie Borden"?

 
By kat on Sunday, 12/30/2001 - 11:41 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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What does this mean?

 
By raystephanson on Monday, 12/31/2001 - 10:49 am [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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It means a little attempt at humor.
Happy New Year!

 
By kat on Monday, 12/31/2001 - 06:27 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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Or a BordeR collie named Lassie Borden.. Please excuse me...I've been DENSE all week!
Happy New Year!

 
By kashesan on Wednesday, 01/02/2002 - 06:49 am [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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Hmm, wonder what would have happened had there been a dog at the Borden house? Jennings might have called him to testify

 
By raystephanson on Wednesday, 01/02/2002 - 04:29 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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"What about the curious incidence of the dog in the night?" "There was no incident with the dog in the night!" "That is the curious incident."

Were there ANY dogs in the neighborhood then? If it didn't bark or make a fuss == known person visiting. Too bad we'll never know.

Except that "Lizzie was guiltless".

 
By kat on Wednesday, 01/02/2002 - 07:54 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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The Dr. Chagnon family had a BIG dog, on the other side of the Borden left rear fence. A Newfoundland or a St. Bernard (test. never specified between the 2).
The Wednesday night BEFORE the murders, remember the Mrs. Dr. & her step-daughter testified they heard 5 minutes of banging at 11 p.m. at that fence. The dog never barked or was affected, according to Mrs. Dr. Chagnon.

 
By kashesan on Thursday, 01/03/2002 - 07:03 am [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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Do I hear a little Sherlock Holmes there Ray? "Silver Blaze" one of my favorites!

 
By raystephanson on Thursday, 01/03/2002 - 03:56 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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Yes, but remember our family lived in a city then, and had no dogs, barking or otherwise. The next block was different.

I don't ever remember anybody talking about this dog! Where is the reference listed?

Perhaps they did not remember the barking, if there was any. Also, a barking dog in the middle of the night does not make for happy neighbors. Could their dog be trained to be barkless, or sleeping? Or they failed to mention it?

 
By kat on Thursday, 01/03/2002 - 09:59 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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The Chagnon ladies were the last couple of witnesses at the Preliminary, and their testimony there was slightly different from what was said at the trial. At the Prelim., I believe it was noted that the dog was unaffected by the "noise".

Nevertheless, in Did She Or Didn't She, Thursday, June 5th, 1893 was printed (supposedly verbatim) testimony from these two Defense witnesses:
Knowlton Q.'s Martha:
Q: Is there a dog on your premises?
A: Yes, sir
Q: What kind of a dog?
A: Newfoundland
Q: Did the dog leave the piazza? (Wed. nite, 11 p.m.)
A: No sir
Q: At no time during the time the noise was going on?
A: No sir.

At the Trial, pg. 1334 Martha is questioned by Knowlton:
Q: Was there a dog on your premises?
A: Yes sir.
A: Where was the dog?
A: On the piazza
Q: What kind of a dog was it?
A: Well, I think a Newfoundland dog
Q: Right on the piazza, right outside of that window?
A: Yes sir
Q: Did he leave the piazza?
A: No sir
Q: No time while that noise was going on?
A: No sir

Knowlton to Marienne Chagnon (Mrs. Dr.-stepmother to Martha) pg.1342:
Q: Did the DOGS sometimes come into your yard?
A: Sometimes: I have seen them

They apparently also had "roaming" dogs in the neighborhood.
They also had a doghouse.
And an ashbarrel that the "DOGS" sometimes take "some bones in the barrels." (pg.1343)

-notice the slight difference in sentence construction between the report in the newspaper (Evening Standard) and the trial transcript.

 
By raystephanson on Friday, 01/04/2002 - 03:42 pm [Edit] [Reply] [Msg Link]  
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So many dogs, so much noise, so nothing new noticed?