Forum Title: LIZZIE BORDEN SOCIETY
Topic Area: Lizzie Andrew Borden
Topic Name: Nap on the couch

1. "Nap on the couch"
Posted by redfern on Dec-2nd-02 at 5:05 PM

Did Andrew nap on the couch often? Was he really napping? Since he was killed in such a way, could he not have just landed there or been layed there? I find it odd that he decided to nap on the couch instead of going to his bed. Especially with him being tall, and the couch being on the small side. Oh well, just a thought. He was an odd man afterall, so maybe that alone explains it.
   RedFern


2. "Re: Nap on the couch"
Posted by Kat on Dec-2nd-02 at 7:47 PM
In response to Message #1.

I've been trying to picture Andrew on the couch in my mind lately.
We know the doctor said his body was lower down in the picture than when he first saw it...BUT, that is what keeps getting to me.  He is too low down to have slipped, and from where his bottom is placed he couldn't have been HIGHER on the COUCH arm--only higher on the bundled up stuff under his head.
So the more I think about his position (as I'm napping on my couch), it does NOT seem at all like a reclining-to-sleep position one would adopt naturally.


3. "Re: Nap on the couch"
Posted by Kat on Dec-2nd-02 at 7:53 PM
In response to Message #2.

Sorry, forgot to attach thumbnail. Didn't want a HUGE picture.


4. "Re: Nap on the couch"
Posted by Carol on Dec-3rd-02 at 1:47 PM
In response to Message #1.

The position of Andrew's body, like the position of Abby's body in the photos are probably close to the position in which they ended up after being killed, but due to other people examining, lifting, etc. the bodies themselves and also movement of furniture and things like the pillows/etc. on the couch and the bedclothes upstairs before the photos were taken we'll never know their exact position when the murderer departed the scene. 

Since it was only an hour before their noon supper Andrew might have thought he only needed really to rest from his morning walk, and so wouldn't have needed to actually go to bed upstairs. Bridget, I think, has him going upstairs on his arrival home, whereas Lizzie doesn't remember him going up, so if Bridget was right, he had the option to stay up there and he didn't.  This leads me to believe he went up to change his shoes, get the cardigan, or maybe drop off something in the safe.

Andrew could have been just drifting, not really napping or actually sleeping on the couch, as you say. That was my thought.  But I think that whatever interaction he had with the murderer other than the whacks, i.e., perhaps the moment of recognition of the person realizing he would be harmed, could have caused him to straighten up IF he had been dozing.  Perhaps his body itself changed position due to reflex reaction to what was happening in his head area once the blows started.

It's very difficult to determine his position when regularly napping on that couch but it is fun to visualize in imagination the many options. He did have his shoes on so I would think that he wouldn't have put his feet up on the couch. How about the row boat position, stomach down in the center of the couch with his feet up in the air to the east and his head up on the arm to the west. A bit bizarre but anyway, as you say he was somewhat odd in his likes.

 


5. "Re: Nap on the couch"
Posted by kimberly on Dec-3rd-02 at 2:14 PM
In response to Message #1.

Would the sitting room have been cooler than the upstairs
bedroom? I lived in a two story house as a child & the
upstairs was always hotter than the downstairs. Perhaps
being over the basement the first floors do stay cooler.



 

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