1. "Time of day in 1892"
Posted by Stefani on Aug-4th-02 at 4:55 PM

I had always thought that since Benjamin Franklin invented daylight savings time that we practiced it since the early days of the US. Not so Magee!

According to this web site, (http://webexhibits.org/daylightsaving/index.html),  Daylight Saving Time has been used in the United States and in many European countries since World War I. Not before as a standard.

So that means that there was no Daylight Savings time in Fall River in 1892. The murders, then, occurred between 8 and 10 am EST, by our current time, right?

PLUS, there was no STANDARD TIME until near the close of the 19th Century. "Standard time in time zones was instituted in the U.S. and Canada by the railroads on 18 November 1883. Before then, time of day was a local matter, and most cities and towns used some form of local solar time, maintained by some well-known clock (for example, on a church steeple or in a jeweler's window). The new standard time system was not immediately embraced by all, however."

Do we know for sure whether Fall River was on their own time or railroad time in 1892?

(Message last edited Aug-4th-02  5:03 PM.)

That's a good point!  If they didn't have daylight savings' time, then it could have been an hour earlier.  But then again, they didn't switch their clocks in the fall, either. 

It sounded like Fall River went by the City Hall clock.  Whenever I've come across a time of something happening in the case, I take into consideration everyone's clocks may not have been the same.  I think the clock in the police station was way off.  One of the cops said that.

Some coincidences here.  I grew up in a place called Peterborough, Ontario where there is a college named after Sir Sanford Fleming (a Scotsman who immigrated to Canada), who invented standard time (which came in between 1883-1884).

I was also watching a program this evening on the heyday of railways.  Railway time was most often the standard in the Victorian era, as it was the main means of travel, shipping & communications.  The main telegraph office (news from the outside world) was most often based out of the railway station.  Trains HAD to be on accurate time schedules, as the tracks were shared, thus timing was of the utmost importance.  Quote from the show, "The entire country moved to Railway Time".  Of course, this is talking about Canada, but our railways were as important across this wide country as they were in the US. 

Because Fall River was a major textile economy in Victorian times, one would think Railway Time would certainly be used as the standard in the community. 

(Message last edited Aug-6th-02  12:09 AM.)

Searched the first 900 pages of trial.
The clock in the police station was questioned against other timepieces but there was no established fact of a discrepancy. .

The Kelly clock was deemed unfit to tell the correct time ("not one to be depended upon...", T.68, 212).

The Gorman paint shop clock, situated above the telephone from which Cunningham called the city marshal, was declared "old and not dependable", during questioning.  It supposedly read "10 minutes to 11", which was not possible. (T. 650)

The clock in the guard room read 11:15, when that same call was RECEIVED. (T.432).

I would think that the police clock would be pretty accurate as much as the City Hall clock, and if these two were near synchronization, then it really wouldn't matter what other clocks said(?)

(Message last edited Aug-6th-02  4:08 AM.)

Stefani,
I am looking at a copy of the Fall River Daily Globe, dated August 6, 1892.  It contains an extensive railway time table to local and distant towns and cities. The scheduled times are stated, without qualification, so I assume they are railway/standard time.

Fall River was a thriving manufacturing city and the railroads were a major factor in their economy. I can't imagine an individual would have to apply a time correction when consulting the railroad time tables, so I am assuming the railway time coincided with Fall River time.
....and as BobcookBobcook would say, " That's my story, and I'm stuck with it

Okie dokie folks,

If the clocks within the city were not dependable or were inaccurate, why were the witnesses continually badgered as to what time it was when the crimes occurred?  Of course they wanted a time line for the murders, but if all clocks were set at different times what difference would it make in the long run, a minute, here ten minutes there.  Especially if the clocks in public places could not be counted on to be correct?  Does this make any sense or is it just me?

Doesn't one writer mention that most people had no watches then. They depended on public clocks (see street scenes from that time) or the factory whistle or church bells.
You can't depend on timing down to the second.
Most people believe their own watches are accurate, but get six together and see if any two agree to the second.

To the second?  How about to the minute.  I can't tell you how many times someone at work will ask me the time and not 2 minutes later will check their cell phone and say, your watch is fast by 5 minutes.  I agree with you Rays, then and now, timepieces are just never 100% accurate, due to human error or the timepiece itself. 

Daylight Saving Time is one hour ahead of Standard Time (spring ahead, fall back). If Abby was murdered at 9:30 AM Eastern Standard Time on August 4, 1892, it is the equivalent of 10:30 AM Eastern Daylight Saving Time on August 4, 2002. If the clock in the Fall River Police Station read 11:15 AM EST when the first call for help came in that is equivalent to 12:15 PM EDST now. And so on. It also means that sunrise in early August in Fall River using Eastern Standard Time is around 4:40 AM (on August 3 Lizzie told Alice Russell the Bordens' milk was delivered to the side porch around 4 AM) and sunset is around 7 PM (approximately the time Lizzie walked to Alice Russell's house to visit on August 3). Again assuming Eastern Standard Time, when Bridget, John Morse, Abby, and Andrew arose and came downstairs between 6 AM and 7 AM on the morning of August 4 the sun had already been up between about 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 hours.

Thank you Doug, for catching my mistake. I have always found it difficult to think about time in my head. Yes, you are correct.

How odd to think of the sun coming up so early! 4:40 AM! I much more prefer the sun setting later. Tonight it was past 8 PM. Lovely.

What if Bridget was not a morning person? Coupled with the fact that this was her half day and she was finished after she made the noon meal, plus she was out late the night before----it's a wonder she was able to remember her name!

Daylight Savings Time was first used in Imperial Germany to aid in the war effort, and use less artificial lighting. It was then adopted by the Allied forces.

Farmers don't like it because cows can't tell time; they just go ahead at their usual time, which can mean missing the milk train. Indiana is still the only state that does not use it (IMO).

Before this, each community had their own time, based on high noon when the sun was directly overhead. The natural thing to do.

The state of Arizona also doesn't use Daylight Savings Time, no switching the clock there.  They want less time in the heat and light of day, I suppose, is the reason.