I thought the name Seabury was kind of an uncommon name. Bowen is a common enough name in that area. I never thought I would find a record of another Seabury Bowen. But I seemed to have found one on the Ellis Island website on the passenger list.
First Name: Seabury
Last Name: Bowen
Ethnicity: USA
Last Place of Residence:
Date of Arrival: Apr 06, 1896
Age at Arrival: 29y 6m Gender: M Marital Status:
Ship of Travel: Orinoco
Port of Departure: Hamilton
Manifest Line Number: 0043
http://www.ellisisland.org/default.asp
Another Seabury Bowen
Moderator: Adminlizzieborden
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Allen
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Another Seabury Bowen
"He who cannot put his thoughts on ice should not enter into the head of dispute." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Gramma
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That is a great find, Allen, but when I went to the original manifest to see who he was travelling with I was amazed. On line 43 which was supposed to be his was one George Haycock (looks like anyway), 21 years, 2 mo and a student. It looks like he is travelling with his mother on the next line. So I checked every line and there was no Seabury Bowen on this manifest!
Then I went and checked the Ship's name and it looks to me like the Rinold, not Orinoco. Now begins the long trek through the Ellis Island site to find the real Orinoco manifest. This has happened to me before on this site. Some transcribers did not do well with the handwriting.
The lesson is to ALWAYS check the original document! Do not depend on what others think it says!
It doesn't mean it isn't there. There probably is an Orinoco with Seabury on it. Just finding the image of the manifest may be impossible.
Gramma
Then I went and checked the Ship's name and it looks to me like the Rinold, not Orinoco. Now begins the long trek through the Ellis Island site to find the real Orinoco manifest. This has happened to me before on this site. Some transcribers did not do well with the handwriting.
The lesson is to ALWAYS check the original document! Do not depend on what others think it says!
It doesn't mean it isn't there. There probably is an Orinoco with Seabury on it. Just finding the image of the manifest may be impossible.
Gramma
She was acquitted!
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Gramma
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Well, I never found the original image but when I went to the transcribed text manifest it seems there was a George Truesdale on the same trip and a George L. Allen, as well as James Potter. March/April in Bermuda........nice!
I have e-mailed the folks in charge and asked them to correct the error. Maybe someday they will hook up the correct original image with ol' Seabury.
Gramma
I have e-mailed the folks in charge and asked them to correct the error. Maybe someday they will hook up the correct original image with ol' Seabury.
Gramma
She was acquitted!
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mbhenty
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I hope to add something new about the Bowen house some day; that is to say:
I have a friend who I have not seen in many years. But his brother in law is a very close friend to me. For years I have been wanting to visit this old friend to pick his Brain about what he may know about the Bowen house. This is all Rumor talk and perphaps I should not even tease anyone with it.............,like my friend teased me. But since I have been talking about Fall River Architecture:
Years ago I was at a family party. My friend, I will call Bob, was there and we all sat around the kitchen table sucking down bruskies, while the women all sat in the livingroom with the kids and potato salad. I'm sure you have been to countless parties like this. This was many many years ago before I had any interest in anything LIZZIE.
My friend Bob was in the wrecking business along with his father. They were the people who demolished the Bowen house back in the 60s. As he sat and drank, he discribed that once the house was completely down and removed, they started on the foundation. It was then that he noticed that there was a large tunnel leaving the Bowen house and going under the road towards the Borden house. "What did it look like Bob?" He described it to be tall enough for someone to walk through or crawl through. I don't remember which. There were other questions but can't remember what they were at the time.
A couple of weeks ago I was at his brother in laws house having super. I asked him about Bob and the tunnel and if that was true. It is so far fetched that I never really investigated it, and could have been just a story but my other friend said he was serious, that something was there. A tunnel to Lizzie's property????????
Well, I have spoke to my friend and he has promised to take me to Bob's house to ask him directly.
But if true, this could have been almost anything, an old sewer Pipe?? He said it was brick lined. Exciting though. We are talking about one of the oldest Fall River neigborhoods.
Again, Fall River being Fall River with it's vast composite of Historically void nitwits, it could have been an old pre Civil War underground railroad trail. If true, they should have stopped demolition and called the FRHS. But, as no one cares today, even less then. They will once again be digging in this location. On the spot is the Fall River Bus Station and an old Mall. It is all to be demolished soon to make way for a court house. If there is any truth to this now would be the time to investigate it, especially since a massive hole will go in place to drop the foundation for the new court house.
So please take this with a pinch of salt. Will investigate. Been eating at me for years now.
I have a friend who I have not seen in many years. But his brother in law is a very close friend to me. For years I have been wanting to visit this old friend to pick his Brain about what he may know about the Bowen house. This is all Rumor talk and perphaps I should not even tease anyone with it.............,like my friend teased me. But since I have been talking about Fall River Architecture:
Years ago I was at a family party. My friend, I will call Bob, was there and we all sat around the kitchen table sucking down bruskies, while the women all sat in the livingroom with the kids and potato salad. I'm sure you have been to countless parties like this. This was many many years ago before I had any interest in anything LIZZIE.
My friend Bob was in the wrecking business along with his father. They were the people who demolished the Bowen house back in the 60s. As he sat and drank, he discribed that once the house was completely down and removed, they started on the foundation. It was then that he noticed that there was a large tunnel leaving the Bowen house and going under the road towards the Borden house. "What did it look like Bob?" He described it to be tall enough for someone to walk through or crawl through. I don't remember which. There were other questions but can't remember what they were at the time.
A couple of weeks ago I was at his brother in laws house having super. I asked him about Bob and the tunnel and if that was true. It is so far fetched that I never really investigated it, and could have been just a story but my other friend said he was serious, that something was there. A tunnel to Lizzie's property????????
Well, I have spoke to my friend and he has promised to take me to Bob's house to ask him directly.
But if true, this could have been almost anything, an old sewer Pipe?? He said it was brick lined. Exciting though. We are talking about one of the oldest Fall River neigborhoods.
Again, Fall River being Fall River with it's vast composite of Historically void nitwits, it could have been an old pre Civil War underground railroad trail. If true, they should have stopped demolition and called the FRHS. But, as no one cares today, even less then. They will once again be digging in this location. On the spot is the Fall River Bus Station and an old Mall. It is all to be demolished soon to make way for a court house. If there is any truth to this now would be the time to investigate it, especially since a massive hole will go in place to drop the foundation for the new court house.
So please take this with a pinch of salt. Will investigate. Been eating at me for years now.
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augusta
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Mbhenly: You certainly grabbed my attention with that post! How utterly fascinating. Yes, it could have been anything. But still it's something I never heard before. Your guesses are very logical, and at this point, if there is a tunnel, I would vote 'sewer'. Maybe it doubled as an underground RR, if that would be possible. Gee, even the FRHS has that hidden passage behind the bookshelf that was used for the RR.
It would be great to know where the entrances were in regard to the Bowen house and Lizzie's. But the city must have known about this structure.
Bowen's house was torn down in 1953. The August 8, 1953 edition of the Fall River Herald News, page 3, ran a huge picture of the house. Sorry, but it is too dark to put on the Forum.
The caption reads: "OLD WAY GIVES WAY TO NEW: Former estate of Dr. Seabury W. Bowen, at 217 Second Street, believed to be more than 150 years old and more recently used as a rooming house for aged people is being torn down to make way for a parking lot. Dr. Bowen was believed to have been the first person called to assist Andrew Jackson Borden and his second wife, Abby Durfee Gray Borden, victims of the world famous and still unsolved "Borden Murder Case." The murders occurred at the Borden home, across from the Bowen property, on Aug. 4, 1892.
There is an article that goes along with it:
LANDMARK ON SECOND STREET TO GIVE WAY TO PARKING LOT
Another Fall River landmark, a two-story, 28 room wooden structure at 217 Second Street, today is the victim of progress.
The home, believed to be more than 150 years old, is being dismantled by the David Laberge Jr. wrecking firm to make way for an addition to the parking lot owned by Joseph A. Bagoriau of 733 Brayton Avenue, Somerset.
The structure, whose records in City Hall go back to 1883, housed the office of Dr. Seabury W. Bowen, believed to have been the first person outside the household, to be called to the house of Andrew Jackson Borden and his second wife, Abby Durfee Gray Borden, victims of an axe slayer on Aug. 4, 1892.
The trial that followed is still the topic of discussion wherever crime is mentioned.
Records in the Assessors' office in City Hall reveal that the property at 217 Second Street in 1883 was owned by Florence G. Hathaway and Charles S. Miller, the former possessing three quarters and the latter the remainder. The bills, however, were sent to Dr. Bowen. Previous owners are not listed. (MY NOTE: Florence Hathaway was Dr. Bowen's daughter. Her husband's name was Horace. I don't know about that date, tho - if she owned part of it in 1883.)
In 1936 Nathan Yamms purchased the home, with the Rialto Amusement Company, Inc., recorded as new owner in 1945. Gaboriau purchased the structure in 1950.
The doctor's office was almost opposite the home where the Borden murders occurred. -END-
In 1883, Dr. Bowen was like 52 years old. I don't know why he would have put his daughter's name on the house when he was so young. Southard Miller was alive then, too. That date sounds wrong. I'll look that up.
It would be great to know where the entrances were in regard to the Bowen house and Lizzie's. But the city must have known about this structure.
Bowen's house was torn down in 1953. The August 8, 1953 edition of the Fall River Herald News, page 3, ran a huge picture of the house. Sorry, but it is too dark to put on the Forum.
The caption reads: "OLD WAY GIVES WAY TO NEW: Former estate of Dr. Seabury W. Bowen, at 217 Second Street, believed to be more than 150 years old and more recently used as a rooming house for aged people is being torn down to make way for a parking lot. Dr. Bowen was believed to have been the first person called to assist Andrew Jackson Borden and his second wife, Abby Durfee Gray Borden, victims of the world famous and still unsolved "Borden Murder Case." The murders occurred at the Borden home, across from the Bowen property, on Aug. 4, 1892.
There is an article that goes along with it:
LANDMARK ON SECOND STREET TO GIVE WAY TO PARKING LOT
Another Fall River landmark, a two-story, 28 room wooden structure at 217 Second Street, today is the victim of progress.
The home, believed to be more than 150 years old, is being dismantled by the David Laberge Jr. wrecking firm to make way for an addition to the parking lot owned by Joseph A. Bagoriau of 733 Brayton Avenue, Somerset.
The structure, whose records in City Hall go back to 1883, housed the office of Dr. Seabury W. Bowen, believed to have been the first person outside the household, to be called to the house of Andrew Jackson Borden and his second wife, Abby Durfee Gray Borden, victims of an axe slayer on Aug. 4, 1892.
The trial that followed is still the topic of discussion wherever crime is mentioned.
Records in the Assessors' office in City Hall reveal that the property at 217 Second Street in 1883 was owned by Florence G. Hathaway and Charles S. Miller, the former possessing three quarters and the latter the remainder. The bills, however, were sent to Dr. Bowen. Previous owners are not listed. (MY NOTE: Florence Hathaway was Dr. Bowen's daughter. Her husband's name was Horace. I don't know about that date, tho - if she owned part of it in 1883.)
In 1936 Nathan Yamms purchased the home, with the Rialto Amusement Company, Inc., recorded as new owner in 1945. Gaboriau purchased the structure in 1950.
The doctor's office was almost opposite the home where the Borden murders occurred. -END-
In 1883, Dr. Bowen was like 52 years old. I don't know why he would have put his daughter's name on the house when he was so young. Southard Miller was alive then, too. That date sounds wrong. I'll look that up.
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mbhenty
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Thank you so much Augusta:
The information given is of great help.
As I stated, the story that I heard was many years ago, so very fuzzy. You see my friend, (who's last name was mention in the news article you posted.) has been seriously ill past couple of years. Also I have not seen him in many years, and I find it rude and offensive to call him to ask about such trival matter, when I have not seen him in years. But I thought that perhaps if I was to tag along with my other friend when he visits his sister I could run into Bob and eventually talk about the case.
But you know, I thought the house was taken down in the late 60s and did not realize that it was that long ago.
This of course puts a new light on things, since my friend would have only been 8 or 9 years old at the time the Bowen house was demolished. So he could have not known about the tunnel first hand, and must have heard it from his father, who was the owner of Laberge Wrecking. (His Dad has long passed away)
Yes, Fall River always loved using the word progress when knocking down valued property. The one property they should demolish is the City Hall. Should have never been placed there. Even to this day city fathers continue to make stupid decisions. They have agreed on money to renovate the City Hall. One City councilman was of the opionion that the money they will spend to repair the City Hall is enough to demolish the existing structure and build a new one at another location, which if true, is a sad discovery. Sad state of affairs when it comes to historical property in this city. That City Hall is one Ugly building inside and out.
And on Bowen's age Augusta:
I think Dr Bowen was probably a wise man, one in tune to his mortality and felt a need to place his house in order. Was not 52 at the time like 65 today?
When I was a young lad I thought for sure I would be dead by 35. I remember thinking, who would want to live much longer. Then I was 35 and thought, OK 50 looks like the new 35. Now I'm........................... well now I don't want to talk about it.
The information given is of great help.
As I stated, the story that I heard was many years ago, so very fuzzy. You see my friend, (who's last name was mention in the news article you posted.) has been seriously ill past couple of years. Also I have not seen him in many years, and I find it rude and offensive to call him to ask about such trival matter, when I have not seen him in years. But I thought that perhaps if I was to tag along with my other friend when he visits his sister I could run into Bob and eventually talk about the case.
But you know, I thought the house was taken down in the late 60s and did not realize that it was that long ago.
This of course puts a new light on things, since my friend would have only been 8 or 9 years old at the time the Bowen house was demolished. So he could have not known about the tunnel first hand, and must have heard it from his father, who was the owner of Laberge Wrecking. (His Dad has long passed away)
Yes, Fall River always loved using the word progress when knocking down valued property. The one property they should demolish is the City Hall. Should have never been placed there. Even to this day city fathers continue to make stupid decisions. They have agreed on money to renovate the City Hall. One City councilman was of the opionion that the money they will spend to repair the City Hall is enough to demolish the existing structure and build a new one at another location, which if true, is a sad discovery. Sad state of affairs when it comes to historical property in this city. That City Hall is one Ugly building inside and out.
And on Bowen's age Augusta:
I think Dr Bowen was probably a wise man, one in tune to his mortality and felt a need to place his house in order. Was not 52 at the time like 65 today?
When I was a young lad I thought for sure I would be dead by 35. I remember thinking, who would want to live much longer. Then I was 35 and thought, OK 50 looks like the new 35. Now I'm........................... well now I don't want to talk about it.
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mbhenty
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Since we have been talking about old buildings, this is a perfect example of what Fall River has been doing to historical property for years.
This photo was take by me the day before they demolished the SPENCER BORDEN SCHOOL, to place a new building on it's spot. On the same property (almost) is Durfee High School, which stands just behind this building.
I was so rocked when I took this shot. They had just finished taking out the windows, just like removing a dead man's teeth as he lay against a stake waiting to be shot.
I was writing an article for the Fall River Herald News about tearing down valued property in Fall River that week. I even wrote a formal letter to Philip Silvia on such matters, and was never dignified with a response. And he is suppose to be on some sort of historical committee.
The next day I drove by. As the bulldozer raped and violated that beautiful building, knocking it to the ground, I felt so upset I ripped up the article and decided that I could not be bothered, no one else cared. There was no out cry and absolutley no talk of this architectual perversion, not much different then tearing down 92. I decided, If I have to stand alone, it wasn't worth it. 
For anyone to demolish a beautifull building in such marvalous condition, was criminal. Sorry, it just upsets me, the stupidity and ignorance.
This photo was take by me the day before they demolished the SPENCER BORDEN SCHOOL, to place a new building on it's spot. On the same property (almost) is Durfee High School, which stands just behind this building.
I was so rocked when I took this shot. They had just finished taking out the windows, just like removing a dead man's teeth as he lay against a stake waiting to be shot.
I was writing an article for the Fall River Herald News about tearing down valued property in Fall River that week. I even wrote a formal letter to Philip Silvia on such matters, and was never dignified with a response. And he is suppose to be on some sort of historical committee.
The next day I drove by. As the bulldozer raped and violated that beautiful building, knocking it to the ground, I felt so upset I ripped up the article and decided that I could not be bothered, no one else cared.
There was no out cry and absolutley no talk of this architectual perversion, not much different then tearing down 92. I decided, If I have to stand alone, it wasn't worth it. For anyone to demolish a beautifull building in such marvalous condition, was criminal. Sorry, it just upsets me, the stupidity and ignorance.
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nbcatlover
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