Lizzie Borden Society Forum

The news is everywhere! Amazing to me that the Lifetime film must have been so successful that they decided to produce a series. The Fall River Chronicles......well, we know it won't be accurate, look like Fall River, and will have invented character. But the series is billed as fiction, so they really can do whatever they wish.

I liked the movie, even though I am probably alone in this, or at least a very small minority, among the Lizzie Borden group. BUT, the general public loved it. And that makes me think that Lizzie may have a life after death after all!

Read this article from the Fall River Herald News. I am quoted. And so is Michael Brimbau, who wrote the new fiction book on Lizzie Borden----Lizzie Borden: The Girl with the Pansy Pin.

Check it out!

http://www.heraldnews.com/article/20141 ... 6/0/SEARCH

Thanks for posting the link to the Fall River Herald News, Stefani. I was interested in reading what you and Michael Brimbau had to say about the new Lifetime mini-series, and was pleasantly surprised to find that Michael Martins was also quoted. I found this article to be wonderfully written, although I was surprised that Deborah Allard misspelled Michael Brimbau’s last name, since she was the one who wrote the article for the Fall River Herald News regarding his novel, Lizzie Borden, The Girl with the Pansy Pin. However, we are all human and we all make mistakes.

I agree, that this TV mini-series will be good for Fall River, because it should bring in more people who are curious to know about the real Borden murder case. I think Michael Martins summed it up quite nicely: “It always stirs interest in the case,” Martins said. “So, it’s a good thing, in a roundabout way. Whether it’s a good thing for poor Lizzie Borden — I doubt it.”

I found an interesting quote by Christina Ricci, which spiked my interest in seeing how she will portray Lizzie in this fictionalized TV series, since she has no doubt that Lizzie was responsible for the murders. The Inquisitr: http://tinyurl.com/p47btlp

I have to admit that I did not like the Lifetime movie, Lizzie Borden Took an Ax, when I first saw it, but recorded it and forced myself to watch it a couple of times; I must say that this movie does have a way of growing on a person, especially when it is viewed as a fictional account of the murders. If the TV mini-series is viewed as it is meant to be viewed, that being a fictionalized account of Lizzie’s life after she was acquitted of the double murders, then I think it is going to be a successful series.

Yes, twinsrwe:

Funny how they got the author's name wrong. Deborah Allard Dion was given a copy of The Girl with the Pansy Pin. She knows the author.

Once you unwrap your mind from around the facts Lizzie Borden took an Axe is not a bad "B" movie. And for someone who does not know the facts, it is that much better. My big complaint was the music. Not the music itself but the use of the music married to the timeline. It just does not work for me... perhaps if I was 18. Another is that.... and with all respect to Christina Ricci, she was the wrong person to play the part. Her face is to sweet, adorable, passive, her stature to small, not imposing enough. I did not believe her as Lizzie Borden. She just never commanded the stage. (screen)

Adding Bertha Manchester's murder to the story made things more confusing. They should have enhanced it or left it out altogether. And the scene with Lizzie making out with some boy.... well, that was just badly written. Either include him as a character or leave him out altogether. The movie appeared rushed. Lizzie burning the dress was a hoot. A scene right out of Macbeth. As fiction it worked well. As to the facts, total disaster. Most Borden Historians I know hated it. Again. You must be a reader of fiction and accept it as a work of fiction, or you will be very disappointed.

I think both movies, including the one with Elizabeth Montgomery, made a mistake of leaving out John Morse. Such an interesting, illusive character. John Morse is the essence and spirit of fiction. In the Girl with the Pansy Pin he was made out to be creepy, sinister, menacing even. Fun character to work with in the world of fiction, because we know so little about his private 'real' life.

I expect the series will be just as awful, if, and I repeat, if you watch it like a documentary. They are not making this series because they are in love with the Lizzie Borden saga,or the truth, but because they must have made lots of money on the original movie. As Devo would say, Whip it Whip it good. And I expect they will whip the heck out of the series.

I told Deborah that if The Girl with the Pansy Pin was ever made into a mini series I would like to see it done in Great Britain, by such directors as Phil Booth and Howard Arunrel, people who directed such series as Downton Abby, Cranford or Monarch of the Glen. Pompous? Perhaps. But the Brits are the kings of the Mini Series. No one does them better.

In any event, nice to see Michael Brimbau spelled correctly, and that someone made note of it. Thanks Twinsrwe.

Welcome back, mbhenty!

Thanks my friend.

You see Franz, I have been lurking in the shadows. Even someone who has studied this crime up and down can always learn from others. So, though I have been quite I do read the forum.

It is difficult not to when the forum Administrator lives upstairs from me.

Nice to see you are becoming a senior member

Now please excuse me while I go celebrate with all my friends......

Senior member? ahahah...

Funny blunders.

When watching a movie I usually miss so much of the story. The reason is that I'm studying the movie set, the background, settings, including architecture, which is one of my best. You screw up and I'll probably pick it out.

Lizzie Borden took an axe is a good examples. Mistakes are made in most movies, and if you are not engrossed in the story you will pick them out. Especially period movies.

There is one gaffe or blunder that is inexcusable in that movie, and at the very beginning. The scene when everyone, Lizzie, Emma, etc. are exiting the church, if you look to the right you can plainly see a plastic trash barrel. The new ones with the wheels. And near it is another large plastic container. In a later scene, you can see a small shed or building in the background with new architectural roof shingles.

One can get pretty picky though. In one cemetery scene, if you look in the background, you can make out some black polished granite grave stones amongst the old ones. You can tell they look new.

Then there is the scene where Bridget is washing the windows. If you look to her right, when she is up on the ladder, you can see the aluminum gutter down pipe. It goes into a large PVC pipe with an aluminum strap around it.

I'm sure there are plenty more. Hope I am not ruining the movie for anyone. After all it is fiction.

mbhenty wrote:Yes, twinsrwe:

Funny how they got the author's name wrong. Deborah Allard Dion was given a copy of The Girl with the Pansy Pin. She knows the author.

Once you unwrap your mind from around the facts Lizzie Borden took an Axe is not a bad "B" movie. And for someone who does not know the facts, it is that much better. My big complaint was the music. Not the music itself but the use of the music married to the timeline. It just does not work for me... perhaps if I was 18. Another is that.... and with all respect to Christina Ricci, she was the wrong person to play the part. Her face is to sweet, adorable, passive, her stature to small, not imposing enough. I did not believe her as Lizzie Borden. She just never commanded the stage. (screen)

Adding Bertha Manchester's murder to the story made things more confusing. They should have enhanced it or left it out altogether. And the scene with Lizzie making out with some boy.... well, that was just badly written. Either include him as a character or leave him out altogether. The movie appeared rushed. Lizzie burning the dress was a hoot. A scene right out of Macbeth. As fiction it worked well. As to the facts, total disaster. Most Borden Historians I know hated it. Again. You must be a reader of fiction and accept it as a work of fiction, or you will be very disappointed.

I think both movies, including the one with Elizabeth Montgomery, made a mistake of leaving out John Morse. Such an interesting, illusive character. John Morse is the essence and spirit of fiction. In the Girl with the Pansy Pin he was made out to be creepy, sinister, menacing even. Fun character to work with in the world of fiction, because we know so little about his private 'real' life.

I expect the series will be just as awful, if, and I repeat, if you watch it like a documentary. They are not making this series because they are in love with the Lizzie Borden saga,or the truth, but because they must have made lots of money on the original movie. As Devo would say, Whip it Whip it good. And I expect they will whip the heck out of the series.

I told Deborah that if The Girl with the Pansy Pin was ever made into a mini series I would like to see it done in Great Britain, by such directors as Phil Booth and Howard Arunrel, people who directed such series as Downton Abby, Cranford or Monarch of the Glen. Pompous? Perhaps. But the Brits are the kings of the Mini Series. No one does them better. …

I agree, Lizzie Borden took an Ax, is not a horrible movie, as long as it is viewed as a fictional movie. I think the people who hated the movie were viewing it as a nonfiction film, which greatly disappointed them. I know that is what happened to me when I first saw it, but when I forced myself to watch it again, with the mindset of it being an factional account, and then I realized it wasn’t as bad as I had first thought.

The music was definitely undesirable for a story line that took place in 1892. I also agree that Christina Ricci, was the wrong person to play the part of Lizzie, for the same reasons that you stated. The real Lizzie Borden was an attractive woman, but she was not sexy by any stretch of the imagination.

Yes, Lizzie burning a dress in her petticoat/nightgown, out in the back yard, was hilarious! I think my favorite scene was when a friend asks Lizzie at a party, “Aren’t you a Sunday school teacher?” Lizzie impishly replies, “Only on Sundays.” That line probably made the real Lizzie Borden turn over in her grave!!!

Good gravy, what were the writers thinking when they left John Morse out of the storyline, in both this movie and the one starring Elizabeth Montgomery? He was in important character in the real Borden murder case. I agree, they should have left Bertha Manchester's murder out of it all together!!!

BTW. I was doing some research and ran across this little ditty, which I thought was pretty clever:

Lizzie Borden got an axe,
gave the writers forty whacks.
When she saw what she had done,
she gave lifetime forty one.

I also think the upcoming Lifetime TV Mini-Series, called. Lizzie Borden: The Fall River Chronicles, is going to be just as bad as the Lizzie Borden Took an Ax movie. However, I look forward to seeing it, keeping in mind that it is a fictional account of the real Lizbeth’s life after her acquittal.

I really like your idea of making The Girl with the Pansy Pin, into a mini-series! I agree, the Brits are the best, when it comes to producing an excellent mini-series.

mbhenty wrote:… In any event, nice to see Michael Brimbau spelled correctly, and that someone made note of it. Thanks Twinsrwe.

You are very welcome, Michael. I am so pleased that you reinstated your membership with this forum! Welcome back, I have missed your excellent posts!!

Yes twinsrwe, thank you for the kind words, It was nice of you.

As I was watching the movie, they made so many mistakes that I reached a moment where I decided this was entertainment, peried. What I call "Subversive Fiction". You know.....like that movie, Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter. What a hoot. They should make one called "Lizzie Borden, Voodoo Goddess."

But now that everyone has heard about the movie, you know better than to go watch the mini series if you hated the movie.

I bet you they change the music. I cant imagine that music throughout the entire mini series.

It's also funny how folklaw gets ingrained in fiction and non fiction. Like Lizzie's pigeons. Lizzie never had pigeons...that were pets anyway. There is no proof that they were hers or not hers. But they were most likely not. They could have been strays. We had a shed on this property where I lived as a child and the pigeons would go up into the loft rafters and make a nest. After a while there were tons of them.

But they love to pass on the pigeon fancy. To tell you the truth, they were used in The Girl with the Pansy Pin. In that book they were also her pets. Makes for a good story, I suppose. Many people believe it and it made the story more interesting. And it does.

In the movie, that's a wonderful opening scene when she's in the loft eating pears and looking out the window, and at the pigeons that are her pets but not her pets. Very Lizzie.... But there is no proof that she ever had them as pets.

I also need to add that this past summer that I sailed my boat up to Lunenburg, where the movie was filmed and walked the "Lizzie" streets. What a great place that little town is. It was a great adventure and I hope to repeat it next year. If they are filming the mini series I could run into one of the scenes screaming, "Lizzie, father is killing your pigeons"

.
I'll take this down after a while Twinsrwe. But for now....

Talking about The Girl with the Pansy Pin...

I had a friend who cut my hair. He did so for 30 years, until his retirement a couple of years ago when he moved to Florida. He was a very interesting and talented fellow. Well dressed, always, and very flamboyant. He always made you feel good about yourself. And even though you knew he was lying, it felt good.

Every time, when he was done cutting my hair, he would swing me around in the chair and tell me I looked like some movie star, who's name he could not remember. Then he would call the receptionist in and say, " Pauline, doesn't Mike look just like a movie star?" As the years went by, when I was waiting in line to have my hair done, I could hear him in the other room tell the person who's hair he was cutting...."you look just like a movie star." Still I couldn't wait for my turn for him to tell me the same.

We had a similar background, upbringing. I lived in the east end and he lived in the North End in Lizzie Borden's fall river. We were both son's of Portuguese immigrants. We would talk about the past, about similar experiences we had and he would always say, " You know, I think we are brothers from different mothers." He was a funny guy.

HIs name was Don Duarte. Don is included in Chapter 8 of The Girl with the Pansy Pin as a character. (as Dom Duarte) I never got a chance to tell him.

I received a call this week that Don had died.

Don Duarte.

mbhenty wrote:.
I'll take this down after a while Twinsrwe. But for now....

Talking about The Girl with the Pansy Pin...

I had a friend who cut my hair. He did so for 30 years, until his retirement a couple of years ago when he moved to Florida. He was a very interesting and talented fellow. Well dressed, always, and very flamboyant. He always made you feel good about yourself. And even though you knew he was lying, it felt good.

Every time, when he was done cutting my hair, he would swing me around in the chair and tell me I looked like some movie star, who's name he could not remember. Then he would call the receptionist in and say, " Pauline, doesn't Mike look just like a movie star?" As the years went by, when I was waiting in line to have my hair done, I could hear him in the other room tell the person who's hair he was cutting...."you look just like a movie star." Still I couldn't wait for my turn for him to tell me the same.

We had a similar background, upbringing. I lived in the east end and he lived in the North End in Lizzie Borden's fall river. We were both son's of Portuguese immigrants. We would talk about the past, about similar experiences we had and he would always say, " You know, I think we are brothers from different mothers." He was a funny guy.

HIs name was Don Duarte. Don is included in Chapter 8 of The Girl with the Pansy Pin as a character. (as Dom Duarte) I never got a chance to tell him.

I received a call this week that Don had died.

Oh, what a sad ending to a wonderful story! Please don't take this post down, Michael. It is a memory you have of your friend, that you will forever cherish. He sounds like he was quite a character. I am sorry to hear of his passing, and I know you regret not telling him that he was included in your book, but I bet his not knowing, didn't lessen the friendship he felt toward you. May he rest in peace.

.


Thanks twinsrwe. That was sweet.

Maybe I will.

Don was an encyclopedia of stories. He loved going to Vegas. He loved the entertainment and restaurants.

I remember the day he told be about meeting Diana Ross in the hall way of the casino. He said he was so excited that he got to talk to her. He thought that she was so polite and kind. She told him to make certain he come to her performance, which he promised to do so. Then she gave him a big wet kiss. He said he was trilled.

That night when he attended the show he discovered that it was not Diana Ross at all but a Diana Ross impersonator.

His stories were all like that. We would laugh and laugh. He was a great guy.


.

Oh yes. I forgot to be more detailed. A Diana Ross MALE impersonator. Thus the wet kiss. Funny stuff.

Now that is funny!

Yes, Don was full of funny stories. Like the time he was in Vegas and was late for the Andrew Dice Clay performance. Hoping to find a seat he was surprised when they arrived that there was a table right up front. He soon discovered why no one was sitting there. Andrew Dice Clay tore him and his wife up to shreds. Really Vulgar show. Dice kept picking on him. He said it was even more embarrassing when he and his wife just walked out, since Dice ridiculed him all the way out the door. What a jerk. But he got his laughs and that was his only concern.

Then there was the time he wanted to have a cigarette, went down this hallway and found a door leading outside. It was perfect. It was behind the building and very private. He soon discovered that this was the entrance for the stars at that certain club and he met Don Rickles. He said he was a gentlemen until the act began and Rickles used him in his comedy act...said he was very insulting, but in a "Rickles" certain sarcasm. But he said after the show Rickles came over and shook his had and had a bottle of wine sent to his table.

Then there was the time he tried following Dolly Pardon and her entourage into the club and was stopped by one of the guards and he quickly added that he was with Miss Pardon. The usher looked over to Dolly who waved him in. He got to sit at her table. A high point in his Vegas vacations.

He was full of these funny stories. He loved going to the shows and never gambled.

Not only a hair dresser, Don was a flower decorator, a fashion expert, and an sketch artist. A very talented guy.

He claimed that the best performances he ever attended was the Cirque du Soleil.

Christian Ricci, Lizzie Borden "expert" talks about Lizzie Borden's "guilt" in the clips below. Her reason? Because "there wasn't anyone else around." Solved!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrOTCv2sZNg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OduCjBo4w4I

I do wish actors and actresses would keep their mouths shut about things they know nothing about! On the other hand, I suppose she knew she would be asked her opinion on the murders and had to come down on one side or the other!

I am just shaking my head.
Very hollywoodish interviews...

[quote="mbhenty"]

Christian Ricci, Lizzie Borden "expert" talks about Lizzie Borden's "guilt" in the clips below. Her reason? Because "there wasn't anyone else around." Solved!



Well! At least we know it's been solved, lol!

Perhaps she had to think like to be convincing in the killer role.

Trailer is up...


http://insidetv.ew.com/2015/01/09/lizzi ... ime-video/

http://www.thewrap.com/lizzie-borden-ch ... etime-tca/

http://tvline.com/2015/01/09/the-lizzie ... me-series/

Ok Lizzie as Dexter is slightly mad but I'm checking it out. I don't mind historical fiction like Boardwalk Empire and this looks like bloody fun. I have to think this exposes a whole new generation to Lizzie's story and the original case.

I thought the movie was entertaining but not great and left many elements of the case unexplored.

I totally think Lizzie killed her parents, by the way.

Excellent Billy! Come and argue with us on the main Lizzie forum, please!