The Barn

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:47 pm

The completion of the barn has added so much to the Second Street landscape, both in recreating more of the look in 1892 and providing a wonderful visitor's center and giftshop for legions who flock daily to shop and tour the house. The interiors are both practical and serviceable as display area for exhibits and merchandise. The hayloft is a great hub to run the correspondence and day to day work of having a B&B and all that entails. Here are some photos for the Lizzie family far away.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:50 pm

LeeAnn thought of a great way to keep that front wooden panel, by having it slide away to reveal practical front windows to lighten the inside of the gift shop. This was taken Sunday morning about 9. Dee is on the left- it was a cool New England morning with a little frost on the punkin'!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:53 pm

This would have been a peartree point of view, which had to give way to the parking lot, sadly. This shot is taken right back where the old fence used to be and gives an impression of the depth of the backyard.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:57 pm

For years I have had a wrong idea of the location of the Chagnon house-which I thought was the big white one right in back of the barn. Apparently I have been wrong and it would have been to the left of the barn farther. This is my favorite photo taken early in the morning Sunday. Of course the old Buffinton manse is gone, but it gives a sort of Lucy Collette POV.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 7:58 pm

LeeAnn added some more windows for light in the hayloft. It is a wonderful space!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:03 pm

Behind the barn- right on the property line. This barn has been moved back a bit to allow for the driveway. I picture that box of clothes being buried!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:04 pm

The gift shop with souvenirs and books. Bob Flynn stopped by Saturday and left a nice stack of Slaughter on Second Street and 40 Whacks as you can see. There is also a television screen mounted on the right for visitors to watch Lizzie docs while they wait for a tour!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:07 pm

A view from the counter, the old sofa was the original one from 1996-now "retired" after thousands of visitors have taken a seat. On the wall over the safe is a collection of 1892 photos of the barn and back yard.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:10 pm

Guests enjoy this exhibit of items found when the privy was excavated- glass, metal, and things which could not be burned- no hatchet!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:11 pm

My favorite is this exhibit of chinaware from the privy with all the patterns. Some white iron stone is in the diningroom as it may have been from the Borden years. I like the flow blue especially.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:13 pm

Here is a view behind the back fence where once stood a small orchard between Crowe's yard and Chagnon's.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:27 pm

Wow, Shelley - spectacular photos. The views of the house from these angles are GREAT.

And my favorite place - the Bahn! You are so right, putting it back up adds tremendously to the whole atmosphere. It looks quite improved in just the two months since we were there. Bravo!

Thanks for posting all the photos.

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 7:35 pm

Shelley @ Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:11 pm wrote:My favorite is this exhibit of chinaware from the privy with all the patterns. Some white iron stone is in the diningroom as it may have been from the Borden years. I like the flow blue especially.

Surely this might lead to question the sanity of those digging for discards?

shakiboo · Post by **shakiboo** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:10 pm

Thanks for the pictures Shelley! They are great!! And Good Grief! Rays do you never have anything kind to say?

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 9:55 pm

I am not sure exactly who you are slamming tonight Ray- me, Lee Ann, the excavators, the builders- or all of us?

It is fairly common practice for those who know what they are doing as far as preservation is concerned, to carefully document a site, preserve and exhibit artifacts of interest. As you may not know, the Borden house was owned by the sisters until 1918 and was a boarding house, button factory, kewpie doll factory and of course print shop over the years. Many people lived here both before and after the Bordens. The sampling of various china patterns , flow blue and transferware are of the Victorian period. Other fascinating items such as a complete china doll, called a "frozen charlotte", metal dippers, nails, medicine bottles and other artifacts serve as reminders of the Past and those who lived at 92 Second. Everyone who enters the gift shop enjoys this display, and I congratulate LeeAnn's spirit in conserving these small pieces of yesteryear for posterity. I will inventory other things found in the privy-some are extremely interesting to most people. For those who find these endeavors and photographs an insane waste of time, why, there's always the Billy Borden/Arnold Brown thread to read.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 10:50 pm

The shards of china are very interesting and were very worthwhile excuvating.

The number of different patterns would seem to indicate they were deposited over a number of years and probably by multiple families. Has Lee-ann tried to tie the patterns to general time periods?

Haulover · Post by **Haulover** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:16 pm

i've wondered the same thing harry asks. these patterns on this china--if there's such a thing as an expert who could date them--if they were mass-produced to some extent. i've got a picture of the light blue and white one on the lower left from when it was in a box in the cellar. i remember from childhood seeing similar designs on dishes--i guess these could change slightly year to year in a general period.

i remember a shoe--or the sole of a shoe--what became of it? i would also wonder if that could be dated.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:27 pm

Flow blue is still being made, the two examples on exhibit -the white plate top right with the flow blue rim, and the bright blue shard is most certainly Victorian, but it was made over a very long period in the 19th century so it could be anything from 1845-1900. Here's a society which offers a lot of info:
http://www.flowblue.com/photos.htm
Transferware is another thing we could do more research on- especially the green and purple, which was popular at a certain period.

Yes, the shoe heel! Bridget said the only time she ever used a hatchet was to knock the heel off her shoe- wouldn't it be fabulous if this heel was Bridget's?!

The chinese export china willow patterns were popular blue and white -the plate with the paler blue and white transfer was a very common pattern which was an American take on that willowware-wish I could recall the pattern name.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:56 am

I remember being very impressed with the mounted display of china pieces. The job was expertly done, I believe to Lee-ann's specifications? And anyone would thrill to see them in person!

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 10:18 am

shakiboo @ Wed Oct 11, 2006 9:10 pm wrote:Thanks for the pictures Shelley! They are great!! And Good Grief! Rays do you never have anything kind to say?

Yes. Lizzie didn't do it, and those who say differenct are just wrong and prejudiced.
Does this meet your standard?

Smudgeman · Post by **Smudgeman** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 10:54 am

Just use your ignore button shakiboo, then you won't have to read the same old comments over and over.

theebmonique · Post by **theebmonique** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:23 am

...AND OVER...AND OVER...AND OVER.

Tracy...

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:55 am

If everyone used his or her ignore button, it would eliminate any problems completely. Think of the power!

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 12:56 pm

love those photos.

Susan · Post by **Susan** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:09 pm

I seem to recall someone posted info in the past about the dishes that the Bordens had for everyday use; the dishes that Bridget set the table with. Weren't they whiteware or creamware? From what I remember, they seemed quite plain, especially when you see all those shards of china that were available in that era.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 1:56 am

I recall that whiteware- but can't find it at the moment.
I searched for *white* and *whiteware* and *dishes,* in Bridget's prelim and trial. No luck, for some reason.

Susan · Post by **Susan** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:04 am

I went in the archives and found the source, John Morse of all people! Trial, volume one, page 146:

Q. And, Mr. Morse, generally how was the table set, that is what kind of dishes or ware were on the table?

A. I think it was white ware.

Hmmm, according to this site, whiteware isn't just all white, it even includes the flow blue pieces that are in Shelley's pic.

http://nautarch.tamu.edu/class/313/cera ... riod-6.htm

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 6:08 pm

Yay! Thanks Susan!

That's a cool site-
...and, the plate examples are in pieces!

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:08 am

Shelley @ Wed Oct 11, 2006 10:55 pm wrote:I am not sure exactly who you are slamming tonight Ray- me, Lee Ann, the excavators, the builders- or all of us?

It is fairly common practice for those who know what they are doing as far as preservation is concerned, to carefully document a site, preserve and exhibit artifacts of interest. As you may not know, the Borden house was owned by the sisters until 1918 and was a boarding house, button factory, kewpie doll factory and of course print shop over the years. Many people lived here both before and after the Bordens. The sampling of various china patterns , flow blue and transferware are of the Victorian period. Other fascinating items such as a complete china doll, called a "frozen charlotte", metal dippers, nails, medicine bottles and other artifacts serve as reminders of the Past and those who lived at 92 Second. Everyone who enters the gift shop enjoys this display, and I congratulate LeeAnn's spirit in conserving these small pieces of yesteryear for posterity. I will inventory other things found in the privy-some are extremely interesting to most people. For those who find these endeavors and photographs an insane waste of time, why, there's always the Billy Borden/Arnold Brown thread to read.

The question remains about the provenance. Were they discarded before the Bordens move in? Or afterwards? Showing the obverse could date the pieces. Why not?

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:12 am

Susan @ Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:09 am wrote:I seem to recall someone posted info in the past about the dishes that the Bordens had for everyday use; the dishes that Bridget set the table with. Weren't they whiteware or creamware? From what I remember, they seemed quite plain, especially when you see all those shards of china that were available in that era.

Growing up in the 1940s we had neighbors who used enameled metal. Would not break, but maybe chip. They were the kind often sold for use by pets (jokes).
I do remember using a metalled cup for children in those days.
Could thrifty Andy ever used such plates?
Could "whiteware" refer to potmetal?

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:14 am

Angel @ Thu Oct 12, 2006 12:55 pm wrote:If everyone used his or her ignore button, it would eliminate any problems completely. Think of the power!

You seem to be filling in for "A*dr*y" in nasty comments about me. Or is this just a coincidence?
The fact that you wish to ignore The Truth (Lizzie Didn't Do It) is your problem, not mine.
'Your results may differ."
PS
I will admit that my viewpoint and knowledge will differ from yours.

Haulover · Post by **Haulover** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:41 am

ray: i'm not sure what all you're saying or suggesting, but i know these things were dug up in the borden back yard. when i was there in 8/05, the back yard was being scraped and dug pretty thoroughly. the artifacts from the privy area were then in cardboard boxes in the cellar and shown by the owner -- i saw them as a result of being in a certain place at a certain time. it just is not possible that these things represent a scam or a conspiracy. surely you don't think they were "planted." there was nothing shady about it -- it was obvious what was going on. there was an unprecedented opportunity for sifting through the dirt.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:44 am

The white ware referred to is white ironstone- a very common and inexpensive but durable every day ware. You have seen it often in tureens and meat platters, chamberpots and bowl & pitchers. It was often used in restaurants and the few fragments found in the old privy MIGHT have been fragments from the Borden's tenure in the house- or maybe not. Other fragments, especially the transferware all date from the Victorian period. Ironstone is still being made. The privy shards were framed in a shadowbox and is on display as an example in the diningroom.
I love to think of Uncle John being Martha Stewart and giving diningroom commentary!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:04 am

A good article from Country Living on ironstone
http://magazines.ivillage.com/countryli ... -2,00.html

Ironstone was often the base stock used to place transfers upon, but white ware was always meant as unadorned ironstone-just plain white. Royal ironstone was white ware with a tiny gold tealeaf usually in the center and was very popular. There are a lot of teapots and sugars and creamers still around in this pattern. Some examples below of white ware.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:17 am

Just to add more to the mix, creamware, redware, greenware, and yellow ware were all terms used for Victorian pottery - and are just about the colors they imply. Yellow ware was most often seen in mixing bowls, molds, and homey kitchen cookingware. Different colored bands around the yellow ware can give a clue to age. I have collected these mixing bowls for many years and the price has really gone through the roof with one tiny yellow ware bowl going for $50 and large mixing bowls up to $200. Andrew would be thrilled!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:24 am

yellow ware bowls, creamware plate, redware bowl.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:50 am

Thanks Shelley for the photos and research.

I could easily see the Borden's using the plain white china. Very practical and since the Borden's rarely entertained they probably wouldn't be particularly concerned with decorative trim.

There is always a certain amount of breakage when handling chinaware so I can't see the Borden's spending heavy on that. Makes me wonder if Bridget's salary was docked for broken items.

Like most people, I have about 5 or 6 coffee mugs. But the one I use each morning is a plain white one that belonged to my grandmother. It must be about 60-70 years old at least and looks like something "rescued" from a Horn & Hardant automat. Still have the saucer to it as well but that has a few chips.

I think it's marvelous that Lee-ann has saved the materials found in the privy area and to display them for the visitors. A glimpse of the past!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:08 am

I have often wondered if Abby received anything from the household when her mother died. I hope she did- maybe some better china or silver. I always felt so touched about Abby saving her little pin money to buy those parlor lace curtains. She was house proud, which I find very sweet, and to do the best with the little she had makes me pity her situation even more.

Some of the older pieces of white ware have a thick raised "lip" around the edge, and the privy piece does, so I am really optimistic that this may indeed be a piece from 1892. With the place as a boarding house off and on, I bet much daily plate was broken.

The diningroom contents of Maplecroft found their way to a number of people, but Mr. Terry did receive a fair amount including silver. This now reposes down in Kentucky, in the china closet of Mr. Terry's daughter-in law. Some is monogrammed LAB, and a silver water pitcher actually has the word Maplecroft on it. Lizzie had nice stuff!

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:39 pm

Haulover @ Thu Oct 19, 2006 1:41 am wrote:ray: i'm not sure what all you're saying or suggesting, but i know these things were dug up in the borden back yard. when i was there in 8/05, the back yard was being scraped and dug pretty thoroughly. the artifacts from the privy area were then in cardboard boxes in the cellar and shown by the owner -- i saw them as a result of being in a certain place at a certain time. it just is not possible that these things represent a scam or a conspiracy. surely you don't think they were "planted." there was nothing shady about it -- it was obvious what was going on. there was an unprecedented opportunity for sifting through the dirt.

No, it just seems like a useless display. What connection the famous Borden case? It seems like over-interest into yesterday's garbage.
Unless they are archaeologists.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:31 pm

"What connection the famous Borden case? "

Well, who knows? It has every connection to the old privy and barn, a place of enormous interest in that case, Lizzie's alibi actually. As a repository of Victoriana that privy and its contents is quite interesting. I recently donated a similar stash found behind my barn to my local historical society who were enchanted to receive these things. I suspect many items at the Smithsonian might be considered "yesterday's garbage" but they are revealing reminders of the past to most people. When you visit the house, you can save time by skipping these things of course.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:18 pm

The view of the side and rear doors from the loft.

Saturday, October 21 1 p.m. after the storm-blue skies!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:20 pm

Imagine Lizzie standing at this window while 3 people are horizontal inside- including Bridget in that upper lefthand window room.

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 9:30 am

Shelley @ Sat Oct 21, 2006 11:18 pm wrote:The view of the side and rear doors from the loft.

Saturday, October 21 1 p.m. after the storm-blue skies!

How sad it is to see how the atmosphere around that house has been so utterly damaged, with all the modern, nondescript, eyesore buildings and lots. It is a shame that all the other houses and trees and yards from that era now have to be imagined. Hard to do when looks around.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 10:17 am

How very true. The bus station also brings in a disruptive noise and sometimes unsettling traffic as well. The good news is that it will be relocated to the outskirts of town eventually and a courthouse is supposed to go up in its place. That's the latest I have heard. It was a huge mistake back in the last inner city rehab to knock down some of the fine old buildings and residences. The hoped for shopping revival on South Main by way of Second Street "shopper's square"never happened. Most people were leery of the odd types hanging around the bus stop after dark. I think the Buffinton -Churchill house burned down- I forget when. Still, we are so lucky to have the Borden house much the same as it was, and the Kelly place next door.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:33 am

I think when the Churchill house burned, it was called the Winslow House?
It was 216 Second Street, anyway.

shakiboo · Post by **shakiboo** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 7:17 am

Thanks for the pictures, again Shelley! Looking at the veiw Lizzie would have had and trying to imagine Mrs. Churchills house really makes it appear narrow and actually the street seen, would pretty much be right out front, and of course the house across the street. almost like tunnel vision, that would hide alot that was going on towards the back of Lizzies, wouldn;'t it?

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 8:04 am

Mrs. Churchill's house was very close to that driveway fence, so looking straight out the window does have a limited tunnel view to the street. I took the first photo from the identical spot. looking to my left with the camera and I could see even further to the Kelly house so the back of the house is highly visible as you can see. from the loft. I will try to get all the site lines today from the hayloft.

Is there a year on that newspaper clipping, Kat?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 3:28 am

I wrote it in pencil at the bottom:
6-1-61.
That's 1961.

Anyone confirm it was called The Winslow House?

Fargo · Post by **Fargo** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 8:32 am

If I get this right then the Churchill house burned on the 34rth aniversary of Lizzie's death. Wasn't there some other coincidence with the dates with someone's birthday or the day they died years before and the day of the murders?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 10:44 pm

Yes, you are right- there were other coincidences:

Martha McGinn's father died on Lizzie's birthday
Her grandparent's wedding anniversary was Aug. 4th
They bought the property Aug. 4, 1947
Martha's birthday is Aug. 4
Martha's younger brother John's birthday is also Aug. 4

--The Fall River Herald News, 20 July 1995