Paranormal?

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Do you believe in any of the paranormal aspects of this (or any other) case?

yes
2
22%
no
2
22%
undecided
5
56%
 
Total votes: 9

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Aamartin
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Paranormal?

Post by Aamartin »

I am curious as to other people's stance on the paranormal
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MysteryReader
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by MysteryReader »

No, here.
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Curryong
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Curryong »

Can I vote 'no' for supernatural elements aound Lizzie and 'undecided' about other cases? I have never heard of anyone confessing to murder in the modern era after being haunted by their victim, for example, but my mind is open to there being ghosts, which could affect other cases.
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taosjohn
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by taosjohn »

Well, I've been prone to precognitive dreams my whole life. Does that count?

They are fragmentary, rare, useless for prophecy or placing sure thing bets, and utterly without spiritual significance as far as I can detect. But I can't explain them...

Example-- in boarding school at age 15 I had the same brief dream three or four times. I was standing in a kind of ramshackly, very hot room with a sort of bay window. A woman was standing with her back to me in the window, and turned and looked at me; she was quite beautiful in a rather severe, silent way.

15 years later in New Mexico I walked into and immediately recognized the room. A couple of weeks later I walked into it on a stiflingly hot day, and the woman was there, exactly as I remembered her, and turned and looked at me, exactly as I remembered her.

I was only acquainted with her for a few months, and she was never especially important in my life, and she didn't become famous or anything. It took me a while to even remember her name just now.

And that one was one of the more detailed ones...
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Aamartin
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Aamartin »

just paranormal in general...

I do not believe that wild eyed woman who went in to 92 2nd and implicated Emma as a sexual offender-- but I do think there are things in our lives we cannot explain with science or rationally.
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

Agree with Anthony...one of my kids came face to face with a ghost. Were she not a PhD in biogenetics I might not have believed her. That afternoon changed her life forever. But the psychic who says, "Ewwww, icky things happened here, really icky, ewwww," does NOT get my vote.
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Franz
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Franz »

debbiediablo wrote:Agree with Anthony...one of my kids came face to face with a ghost. Were she not a PhD in biogenetics I might not have believed her. That afternoon changed her life forever. But the psychic who says, "Ewwww, icky things happened here, really icky, ewwww," does NOT get my vote.
Wow! I would like to hear more details.
"Mr. Morse, when you were told for the THIRD time that Abby and Andrew had been killed, why did you pronounce a "WHAT" to Mrs. Churchill? Why?"
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

My daughter was either a sophomore or junior in college and working as a CNA (Certified Nursing Assistant) for an elderly woman in her late 90s, still living in the same home she and her late husband built after WWII. Her name was Idrose. Odd things kept happening like knocking noises at the windows. The door to the upstairs wouldn't stay closed even if a chair was set in front of it. Anything that was moved ended up back in the same place no matter how many times it was moved. (Idrose was confined to bed, could no longer walk, although staff wondered if she was somehow sleepwalking.) Sally had worked there for a number of months but lots of CNAs would stay for two or three days and then quit, scared out of their wits. One of the visiting nurses insisted on stuffing a towel in the crack between the floor and the basement door.

My daughter was in the basement (semi-finished with the husband's desk, briefcase, phone and financial ledger still there in the same place as when he died about 35 years before. I visited there once in awhile and remember it was an old turquoise rotary phone and the ledger was dated 1966). My daughter had her back to the desk and was taking clothing out of the dryer when suddenly the room got very, very cold. She felt like someone was watching her, turned around and a guy about age 40 - she described him as see-throughish, not fully corporeal - was sitting at the desk staring at her. She recognized him as the woman's husband, the same guy standing beside his airplane in the photo on the wall next to the desk. She dropped the laundry and stared at him. He stared at her. They stared at each other for several minutes. She says his eyes were dark and piercing. Then he slowly faded away right before her eyes, and the room warmed up as he faded.

She ran upstairs and started digging through her employer's bureau drawers looking for more pictures of the husband. Her employer asked what she was doing, and my daughter (who was crying by this time and when she called to tell me about it a few minutes later) ...my daughter said something unnatural had happened in the basement and she needed to make sure she saw what she thought she saw. Idrose (who was sharp until the day she died) chuckled and said, "Oh you must've met Merle. He's always here. I talk to him in my dreams. Don't worry, though, he's a good guy." Sally said she did talk incessantly in her sleep.

Since then she's earned her PhD in biogenetics from MIT but she no longer insists that everything that's true must be scientifically validated. On that day my daughter went from an atheist scientist to a believer in something lingering on past death.
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twinsrwe
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by twinsrwe »

I voted, undecided, however, I should have voted, YES. I do believe in paranormal activity, premonitions, clairvoyance and the supernatural.

I had mental ‘visions’ regarding the safety of my handicapped son, when he was a child and I was a single parent. These visions occurred when I would be in the middle of taking a shower; one day I had a vision of my son on the top step of my 3-step ladder, reaching up into the cupboard above a lit burner on the stove. I immediately got out of the shower, threw a towel around myself, ran out to the kitchen, and found my son in exactly in the situation my vision had foretold. I’m definitely clairvoyant when it comes to my son and his safety.

Three to four months before my father passed away, I had a repeated dream, in which I was riding in the passenger seat of the car right behind the hearse, on the way to the cemetery. The day before my father died, he had phoned me and my siblings, asking us to come home, because he wanted to see us. At the time, I was married to my first husband, who absolutely refused to let me use our only car to make the long drive to my parents house. My father passed away that night. I can’t describe the mental anguish I endured, due to the fact that I was not able to fulfill my father’s wishes, as well as the opportunity to see my father for the last time. On the day of his funeral I was determined to ride in any other seat except the passenger seat of the car right behind the hearse. Well, guess where I ended up? I couldn’t believe it! Once I returned to work, I was filled with mental torments of guilt, which engulfed me, because I knew I would have to live the rest of my life, knowing I was not able to see my father on the last day of his life on earth. At this time in my life, I was working as a Pharmacy Technician in a nursing home, which had an in-house pharmacy; this pharmacy was located in a cottage separate from the nursing home. It was approximately two weeks after my father’s funeral, that I was filling unit dose cassettes with medications, when the room became very cold; I could see my breath!!! All of a sudden, I felt an ice cold hand being placed on my right shoulder, from behind me. Within a single moment, the most overwhelmingly peaceful feeling came over me, and all of the mental anguish, torment and guilt feelings I had been feeling disappeared.

I know that the Walker House, in my home town of Mineral Point, WI., is haunted. Although I have not personally encountered the paranormal activity that is within the building, one of my cousins have. At one point in time, she worked at the Walker House when it was open as a restaurant. She told me that she heard voices, heavy breathing and footsteps in areas where she was alone in a room, there were also temperature changes and doorknobs would turn but the door did not open. There are at least two male entities that have been seen, heard or felt by staff and visitors. It is believed that one of the entities is a guy by the name of William Caffee…

On February 23rd 1842, in the small town of Gratiot's Grove just south of Mineral Point, Wi., William Caffee and Samuel Southwick were attending a housewarming celebration at the home of Fortunatus Berry. William Caffee was known to be a notorious alcoholic, which only made things worse when a fight broke out between him and Samuel Southwick, Caffee drew his pistol and shot Southwick near the heart, killing him instantly. Caffee was arrested by the local sheriff, George Messersmith, and charged with first degree murder. He was tried, convicted and sentenced to hang by Judge Jackson. On November 1, 1842 a scaffold was erected in a flat area near the point of Mineral Point bluff, which is located a short distance to the right of the Walker House. A crowd of 4,000 to 5,000 people came to watch the execution.
Last edited by twinsrwe on Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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Curryong
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Curryong »

My goodness, twins, what interesting experiences you have had with the paranormal, and how wonderful that your father came to you to tell you not to torture yourself with regret any more!
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twinsrwe
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by twinsrwe »

Thanks, Curryong. Yes, it is interesting, because I have been at peace, regarding my father's death, ever since he came back to touch my shoulder.

When I was growing up, I felt that I was the ‘least’ favorite of my father's children, because he was so hard on me. He wouldn't allow me date, go to dances, hang out with friends, etc. Yet, he allowed my younger sister to do all of those things! I could never figure out why, until I went to see my mother one day, after he had passed away. We were going through some family pictures and I pulled out my framed 8x10 high school graduation picture. Tucked in the corner of the frame was a picture of a young girl, who appeared to be about my age, wore her hair in the exact same style I wore mine, except she had her hair parted on the opposite side that I parted mine. If I didn’t know better, I swear we were the same person, identical twins!!! I asked my mother who this girl was. She told me that it was my father's younger sister, who had passed away at the age of twenty. Of all his siblings, she was the one he was closest to. She also told me that he had tucked her picture in the corner of my graduation picture, because I had always reminded him of her. I asked her if that was why he was always so hard on me. She said that it was and that he went to great length to protect me, because he didn’t want anything bad to happen to me.

I know that my father loved all of his children; he didn’t love one child more than the others. I just happened to remind him of a sister he had dearly loved and lost.
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

As some of you know, my daughter's dog Maynard slipped out the door and was run over about a month ago. We were devastated. Maynard was a very much loved dog who was exceptionally smart. One of the places Maynard preferred to nap was next to the radiator pipe in the dining room with his head in one of my daughter's sandals. Maynard was a LaChon, so we went to get a new LaChon puppy and came home with two 3 mo old male LaChons (Lhasa Apso-Bichon Frise cross) they named Autrey and Kiefer, now called Tep and Kiffie. Oddly the last few weeks Kiffie, who belongs to my younger daughter as did Maynard, has taken to sleeping next to the radiator pipe with his head in my daughter's sandals. This is an odd place for any dog to nap, and even odder for two in a row. Last night my daughter took a picture of Kiffie sleeping with his head in her sandal and hovering next to him was what is commonly called a camera artifact or (if you believe that energy remains after death) an energy orb. We tried to replicate the orb elsewhere under the same lighting conditions but nothing appeared. She has used this camera for several years but this is the first orb ever. The toys you see belonged to Maynard and now to the puppies. The other puppy barks at something invisible on a regular basis.

That is a truly beautiful story, Twins...understandable how at peace and loved you must feel. I believe that there are many, many things about life, death and nature that none of us understand.
rsz_energy_orb.jpg
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twinsrwe
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by twinsrwe »

debbiediablo wrote:… Last night my daughter took a picture of Kiffie sleeping with his head in her sandal and hovering next to him was what is commonly called a camera artifact or (if you believe that energy remains after death) an energy orb. We tried to replicate the orb elsewhere under the same lighting conditions but nothing appeared. She has used this camera for several years but this is the first orb ever. The toys you see belonged to Maynard and now to the puppies. The other puppy barks at something invisible on a regular basis. …
Wow, Debbie, that orb is plainly visible! I’m sure it’s Maynard, who is watching over the new puppy sleeping in ‘his’ bed. Thank you for sharing this story and the picture; it’s proof that paranormal activity does exist.

I find it interesting, that the other puppy barks at something invisible. One of my cousin’s (not the same one who worked at the Walker House) daughter, who was maybe 3 years old at the time, would get behind a recliner they had in their living and talk to something invisible to her parents; she would carry on an entire conversation. When asked who she was talking to, she said it was ‘her friend’.
debbiediablo wrote:… That is a truly beautiful story, Twins...understandable how at peace and loved you must feel. …
Thanks, Debbie, I do feel at peace and loved.
debbiediablo wrote:… I believe that there are many, many things about life, death and nature that none of us understand.
I agree!
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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Aamartin
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Aamartin »

I, too believe in paranormal phenomenon. Not some of the things we see on fictionalized television shows, ie- Supernatural, etc.

I believe people can be psychic-- but not most of the 'famous' ones.

NDE's? They are too similar to be explained scientifically-- but I do not believe the 'God is Real' book-- too literally based on The Bible, which is so translated, who knows?

I REALLY wish I have had a personal experience-- Personally, I would not be afraid as much as comforted.
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

This happened tonight. My daughter and both puppies were upstairs in her bedroom. The house she lives in is about 120 years old. She has autism and you can see some of her 'collections' in the background. :smiliecolors: Kiffie's body is in the lower part of the photo and Tep's head blocks out Kiffie's. At first they look like a pile of fur. Tep has an inside out left ear. Tep starting barking at the bedroom door so my daughter grabbed her camera and snapped a photo in the direction of where Tep was barking. Kiffie was ignoring the whole fracas. What she caught on digital is another orb that appears to be leaving a small trail as it moves in through the bedroom door. It's visible when the photo is enlarged. If you trace from where Tep's eyes would be looking, it's directly at the orb. As second after the camera flashed, Tep launched forward right over Kiffie toward the orb. His bark was similar to how he barks at Rex the miniature Schnauzer who lives next door. The person on the right is my daughter's houseguest.
rsz_bedroom_orb.jpg
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

I agree Anthony...it would be comforting.
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twinsrwe
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by twinsrwe »

Oh, WOW, Debbie; after enlarging the picture, it is very plain to see that Tep is looking directly at the orb!!! :shock: I believe this is the first time I have seem an orb leave a trail – how interesting! Thanks for posting this photo and the information that goes with it.
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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twinsrwe
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by twinsrwe »

Aamartin wrote:... I REALLY wish I have had a personal experience-- Personally, I would not be afraid as much as comforted.
I agree, Anthony. I'd say 98% of the personal experiences I have had were, in the end, very comforting. However, I had one experience that was NOT at all comforting, as a matter of fact, I was left with a feeling of 'what the h___ was that all about'! (Excuse my language).

Several years ago, one of my dearest friends had separated from her first husband; while they were separated, both of them began seeing other people. They finally divorced; he committed suicide shortly after they were divorced. A couple of years later, my friend married her second husband. I attended the wedding, reception and dance. During the entire proceeding, I felt odd, as if there was an invisible presence lingering around me. After the dance, we decided to head back to my friend’s house for a drink and small talk, before the guests headed home.

I had been ‘nursing’ a beer during the entire reception and dance, and although it was warm and yucky by the time we decided to go to my friend’s house, I took it with me. My friend's house was located out in the country, and the only road going to her place was a gavel one. I was driving behind another car, and the bride and groom were right behind me. As I was driving, I felt that invisible presence, even more strongly than I had all day long; it was as if this presence was to driving my car for me. We came to a bend in the road, so I slowed down, to maybe 20 MPH, because I was not as familiar with the road as the local people were. As I going into the bend, my car ‘fish-tailed’. Next thing I know, my car had gone up onto the embankment on my right, flipped and rolled over and couple of times, and then landed across the gravel road. I went to get out of my car, but the only thing I saw was gravel!!! My car had landed on the driver’s side, across the road. I quickly climbed out the passage side window, just as the bride and groom were coming around the bend at a fast speed; I saw their head lights, and dove from the passage side window into the ditch. The bride and groom slammed on their brakes, and luckily, all of the cars behind them were able to stop. Luckily no one was hurt, unfortunately, my car was totaled!!! Of course, the cops had to be called, and even though it was quite obvious that I had a beer in my car, because it had gone all over the interior of my car. The cops knew the bride and groom, and that they were on their way home from their wedding dance, so, I was not ticketed.

After my car was towed away, I rode to my friend’s house in their car. Once there, the groom told the wedding party, that they saw me climbing out of my car, as they were coming around the bend, and the only reason they saw me was because I was wearing a white blouse. He also told us that when his wife saw me climbing out of my car, she flew across his lap, opened the driver’s side door, and climbed out of their car, before he had come to a complete stop! I had mentioned to my friend about the invisible presence I had felt all day long, and how this invisible presence seemed to have had control of my car before the accident. She told me that she had also felt the invisible presence all day long, and just before she and her husband were going go into that bend in the road, she knew something terrible had happened. We both KNEW that the invisible presence was her dead first husband. Perhaps, he didn’t want her to re-marry, or maybe he just wanted to ruin her wedding night and honeymoon.

Since my car was totaled, I had to stay overnight at my friend’s house, and then they drove me the 2 ½ hour drive back to my place the next day. To this day, I hear from the groom, in a teasing manner, how I ‘interfered’ with their wedding night; I did indeed make the wedding night a memorable one, that was absolutely unique!
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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debbiediablo
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by debbiediablo »

The house where my daughter lives belongs to my husband and me. It was built in the late 1800s and then had kitchen, laundry room with 3/4 bath, another full bath, downstairs bedroom and a side deck added in the late 1980s. The upstairs has three bedrooms, an old-fashioned bath with slipper tub and a walk-up attic. It was built by the Baldridge family; they had three daughters. One married and moved to another part of the country. The remaining two, Alice and ?? were dating brothers. The Baldridge parents approved of one of the brothers and ?? married him. They didn't like the other one, possibly due to a drinking problem although whether it was a 'problem' or simply because he partook of alcohol isn't clear. For whatever reason, they forbade Alice to marry him after they became engaged.

I don't know what happened to the fiancé, but Alice never married. She lived her entire life in the family home and died there in the 1980s with the house pretty much unchanged. Even the carriage house on the alley was still in use. (Now replaced with a three-car garage.) When Alice's nieces went in to prepare for auctioning her estate, they opened the buffet in the dining room. Inside they found her engagement ring and the untouched fabric for her wedding gown from maybe 70 years previous. Alice spent her entire adult life watching her sister married to the brother of the man she loved, her sister having children and then grandchildren.

Both of my daughters who are living and also the one who passed away are-were sensitive to the paranormal as was my mother. I'm like Kiffie in the orb photo - totally oblivious. The first time my oldest saw the house her initial words were, "It's watching us. That house is energized." Later on I heard what sounded exactly like footsteps upstairs but the only other person present was my youngest who was in the backyard. I could see her even as the walking around was going on. I decided it didn't really happen, that I was mistaken about what I knew I'd heard. However, since my youngest has been living there I sometimes hear her upstairs 'talking' to Alice. "Dammit Alice, stop shutting that door!" If Alice is still there, my daughter seems to co-exist with her fairly well.

The family of one my daughter's friends lived there for awhile in the early 2000s, and her mother died in the downstairs bedroom. This is a huge master bedroom with a large walk-in closet. Bot somehow it ended up as the storage room. Without even making the decision, I choose to sleep in a daybed in the parlor when I stay overnight. And the deceased woman's daughter absolutely refuses to set foot in that bedroom nor will she allow her kids in there. We've never asked why. I often wonder about what energy remains in this house. Nothing bad has happened although items are often misplaced. But this is my daughter with autism and her organization and attention can be limited at times.

Too bad houses cannot talk...or maybe the can...in their own way. What a story 92 Second Street could tell.
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Franz
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by Franz »

Exciting!

I personally haven't experienced any paranormal phenomena, but I heard many stories of this kind.

I am re-reading a French book entitled La légende de la mort, The legend of the death, very interesting. I would like to translate into in Chinese.
"Mr. Morse, when you were told for the THIRD time that Abby and Andrew had been killed, why did you pronounce a "WHAT" to Mrs. Churchill? Why?"
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irina
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Re: Paranormal?

Post by irina »

Fascinating stories!

I have had intermittent psychic experiences. I get impressions of things and am frequently correct. I am deeply religious so have asked God that I never see anything unless He sends it to me. The worst experience was that I was present in some form when a close friend was murdered. I can't talk about it because I know things only the police know. The murderer was never caught.

Other impressions are not necessarily negative and can be positive. I have too much of a headache right now to explain any of them.

I think where the professional psychics go wrong is that they try to perform. I think these things come, for whatever reason. I could say they come from God or the other side. Others may say it is a part of life we don't understand. I think people like Sylvia Browne really want to help people and they try real hard, too hard, at times. Then they get false readings and critics are brutal. I think these things have to come as a gift from whatever the source.

Basic chemistry and physics tells us that there is no matter, only light. Atoms can be split until matter becomes energy and energy becomes matter. Photons held tightly into energy configurations make up matter. If the nucleus of an atom was the size of a tennis ball the nearest electron would be as far away as Mars. Energy trapped into configurations with lots of space in between. Why shouldn't thoughts and actions have substance? The Bible begins with God saying," Let there be light". That is far more profound than we realise at first.

I do a bit of remote viewing which is similar to psychic activity. I have tried to remote view the Borden case and don't get any strong impressions. I have had correct impressions on some other historic unsolved cases though nothing earth shattering, or that solved mysteries. An idea gained through remote viewing could send research in certain directiions. If we had better police records from the Borden case I think remote viewing could be helpful. Without a good list of other suspects in this case we have a great deal less than modern cold case detectives have.
Is all we see or seem but a dream within a dream. ~Edgar Allan Poe
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