Sodder Children Mystery

[Franz]

Just found this:

http://www.historicmysteries.com/sodder ... n-mystery/

[MysteryReader]

Thanks, Franz for sharing! I have read about this case and it is indeed puzzling.

[twinsrwe]

Wow, Franz, that is one creepy story.

I will do some research on it and see if I can come up with anything.

Thank you for sharing this with us.

[Aamartin]

very interesting-- I too and going to google and read all I can on this

[Aamartin]

There is a lot of theories and information-- some different from various sources.

[debbiediablo]

This is indeed interesting Franz. My initial question is why not lock the door and possibly close the curtains at the time the parents went to bed? Second question, why was a ladder always leaned up against the house? Third, had their vehicles been tampered with? And, does the DNA in the supposed finger bones match the only living sibling? A fascinating case that appears to be one bungle after another.

[Aamartin]

In addition, certainly the two oldest children would have, at some point, had an opportunity to tell someone who they were.... Even if they waited till they were adults.

[Franz]

In addition, certainly the two oldest children would have, at some point, had an opportunity to tell someone who they were.... Even if they waited till they were adults.

I agree. I am not very optimist about the surviving of these five children. They were probably killed, or soon after the kidnapping, in the same night, or in one of the following days.

That was the Christmas night. A special moment. What I can imagine is that the kidnapper deceived the children --- to be noticed that they were the youngest ones (except the baby girl of 2 year old) --- by saying to them: "Hey, this night these is a very funny party for children somewhere. Do you want to go with us?" Any way the kidnapping would not have been violent, since the 17 year old sister was sleeping in the living room, on the same floor, and she was not awaked.

Anyway I think the parents' testimony was reliable. And you?

[Franz]

This is indeed interesting Franz. My initial question is why not lock the door and possibly close the curtains at the time the parents went to bed? Second question, why was a ladder always leaned up against the house? Third, had their vehicles been tampered with? And, does the DNA in the supposed finger bones match the only living sibling? A fascinating case that appears to be one bungle after another.

Debbie, your first question doesn't worry me alot. In that locality it might have never occured anything of brutal before.

The second question I want to know if the ladder was found somewhere after the accident.

Do you think the children survived for a long time the kidnapping --- I think they were kidnapped ---?

[Aamartin]

At my house, when we are 'all in' for the night-- the doors get locked. Even if that is at 6pm. Dogs in and out-- I re-lock the door.

While I do not believe the parents lied about anything-- I do wonder why they let their children sit up, late, alone-- without locking the doors.

In many of the threads I read in other forums-- it seems that the house may have been heated by coal which they say burns very hot....

There are so many coincidences that it seems almost impossible to think they died in that fire and were never found (ladder, cars not working, phone lines cut, etc) -- but I have to think that they either died in the fire and somehow their remains were never found or they died immediately or soon after.

I was shocked that I wasn't able to find any 'psychics' opinions on the web.

[Franz]

I think that some decades ago, in some rural area in China, people didn't lock the door the night.

[Aamartin]

I think that some decades ago, in some rural area in China, people didn't lock the door the night.

There are people today in the small town I live in who do not lock their doors and leave keys in their cars! However, the fact that Mrs. Sodder instructed her children to lock the doors shows they did have the habit of locking them at night. The only thing I considered is that they might not have had indoor plumbing yet-- but it is my opinion that they did.

[twinsrwe]

… My initial question is why not lock the door and possibly close the curtains at the time the parents went to bed? …

As a parent myself, I also have to ask why those parents didn’t lock the door and close the curtains before they went to bed? It just struck me as a strange, and extremely odd, thing for parents to leave those two particular tasks in the hands of 5 kids.

The other thing that struck me as being extremely odd for a parent to do was, when the mother got up around midnight to answer the phone, she noticed that the lights were still on, the front door was not locked and the curtains were still open. She took care of these things, and then went back to bed, without checking on her children. Man, I would have definitely checked on my kids!!!

[debbiediablo]

Good point, Anthony, about the outdoor plumbing. Other aspects of the community seem backward (the switchboard operator appears to have taken off Christmas...fire department shows up perhaps after their kids enjoyed Christmas morning, many hours late...police are casual in the face of five children either dead or missing) so I'm thinking outdoor plumbing may be probable. Twins and I, for two, can remember outdoor plumbing except in the rural Midwest - ten or more years later than 1945. At that time mining towns in West Virginia weren't highly developed either.

I don't think the Sodder parents would spend the final 20 years of their lives searching for these five kids unless they were absolutely convinced the children didn't die in the fire. Given that we teach our children that Santa can lug a bulging bag of toys down a chimney and has flying reindeer (I told mine that it's fun to pretend this...never that it was real) the idea that kids could be lured out of the house by someone in a Santa suit or someone "representing" Santa isn't far-fetched. I can see this happening, especially at a time when childhood was still a period of relative innocence.

I was born in rural Iowa shortly after Christmas 1950. On the coldest nights my Dad went out and started the car every hour to make sure it would turn over and fire when Mom went into labor. So perhaps the vehicles are a lesser part of the mystery. Maybe the batteries failed or Mr. Sodder flooded the carburetor in understandable haste. Somewhere I read that the ladder was found on the ground far from the house. Was it moved so the remainder of the family would be trapped upstairs? Or used to bring the five kids out of their bedroom windows?? There's even the possibility that Mrs. Sodder locked someone in who was then seen by the children.

As for locking the door, Twins and I are on the absolute same page about this. I cannot see a mother leaving this to young children when she could do it herself unless it was the kids' job every night (with 10 children there is a division of labor different than with 3 or 4, plus the older daughter was asleep on the sofa) OR, as Anthony offers, they had outdoor plumbing. In this area doors started being locked at night in the mid 70s. My brother-in-law and his wife didn't lock theirs until they were awakened in their upstairs bedroom by an elderly neighbor trying to crawl under the sheets with them! He had Alzheimer's and grew up in their house. He got confused on the way home, ending up in his childhood bedroom rather than at his own home located a mile north. The next day they installed new locks!!!

Here is another interesting site about the Sodder children and hopefully accurate given it's from The Smithsonian. Some other possibilities come to mind when reading it. And thank you, Franz, for finding something new for us Bordenites to study; this is, indeed, a big mystery!

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/t ... 172429802/

[Aamartin]

… My initial question is why not lock the door and possibly close the curtains at the time the parents went to bed? …

As a parent myself, I also have to ask why those parents didn’t lock the door and close the curtains before they went to bed? It just struck me as a strange, and extremely odd, thing for parents to leave those two particular tasks in the hands of 5 kids.

The other thing that struck me as being extremely odd for a parent to do was, when the mother got up around midnight to answer the phone, she noticed that the lights were still on, the front door was not locked and the curtains were still open. She took care of these things, and then went back to bed, without checking on her children. Man, I would have definitely checked on my kids!!!

I agree-- I would have checked on them too. A little more reading and I realized I sort of blew off that the parents seem to have slept on the first floor . While this doesn't change much it is an interesting point. Another thing-- I close the curtains when it gets dark to avoid the 'fish bowl effect' , but if I lived in a rural area where no one would be able to easily see in, I might not close them at all. However-- it was a cold night -- and windows were not as good as they are now. Living in houses with old windows-- I would close the curtains against the wind/cold that can blow in thin windows. And my mom always went around opening curtains before bed so the sun shone in right away in the morning-- but she didn't mind the fish bowl effect either!

[Aamartin]

Good point, Anthony, about the outdoor plumbing. Other aspects of the community seem backward (the switchboard operator appears to have taken off Christmas...fire department shows up perhaps after their kids enjoyed Christmas morning, many hours late...police are casual in the face of five children either dead or missing) so I'm thinking outdoor plumbing may be probable. Twins and I, for two, can remember outdoor plumbing except in the rural Midwest - ten or more years later than 1945. At that time mining towns in West Virginia weren't highly developed either.

I don't think the Sodder parents would spend the final 20 years of their lives searching for these five kids unless they were absolutely convinced the children didn't die in the fire. Given that we teach our children that Santa can lug a bulging bag of toys down a chimney and has flying reindeer (I told mine that it's fun to pretend this...never that it was real) the idea that kids could be lured out of the house by someone in a Santa suit or someone "representing" Santa isn't far-fetched. I can see this happening, especially at a time when childhood was still a period of relative innocence.

I was born in rural Iowa shortly after Christmas 1950. On the coldest nights my Dad went out and started the car every hour to make sure it would turn over and fire when Mom went into labor. So perhaps the vehicles are a lesser part of the mystery. Maybe the batteries failed or Mr. Sodder flooded the carburetor in understandable haste. Somewhere I read that the ladder was found on the ground far from the house. Was it moved so the remainder of the family would be trapped upstairs? Or used to bring the five kids out of their bedroom windows?? There's even the possibility that Mrs. Sodder locked someone in who was then seen by the children.

As for locking the door, Twins and I are on the absolute same page about this. I cannot see a mother leaving this to young children when she could do it herself unless it was the kids' job every night (with 10 children there is a division of labor different than with 3 or 4, plus the older daughter was asleep on the sofa) OR, as Anthony offers, they had outdoor plumbing. In this area doors started being locked at night in the mid 70s. My brother-in-law and his wife didn't lock theirs until they were awakened in their upstairs bedroom by an elderly neighbor trying to crawl under the sheets with them! He had Alzheimer's and grew up in their house. He got confused on the way home, ending up in his childhood bedroom rather than at his own home located a mile north. The next day they installed new locks!!!

Here is another interesting site about the Sodder children and hopefully accurate given it's from The Smithsonian. Some other possibilities come to mind when reading it. And thank you, Franz, for finding something new for us Bordenites to study; this is, indeed, a big mystery!

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/t ... 172429802/

Oh how I remember the days before fuel injection and worrying about cars not starting in Iowa!

[Aamartin]

http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=99826.0

[twinsrwe]

...Here is another interesting site about the Sodder children and hopefully accurate given it's from The Smithsonian. Some other possibilities come to mind when reading it. …

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/t ... 172429802/

Thank you for posting the link to The Smithsonian, Debbie. There are a couple of things that stood out for me in that article:

… There was a stranger who appeared at the home a few months earlier, back in the fall, asking about hauling work. He meandered to the back of the house, pointed to two separate fuse boxes, and said, “This is going to cause a fire someday.” Strange, George thought, especially since he had just had the wiring checked by the local power company, which pronounced it in fine condition. Around the same time, another man tried to sell the family life insurance and became irate when George declined. “Your goddamn house is going up in smoke,” he warned, “and your children are going to be destroyed. You are going to be paid for the dirty remarks you have been making about Mussolini.” …

… The older Sodder sons also recalled something peculiar: Just before Christmas, they noticed a man parked along U.S. Highway 21, intently watching the younger kids as they came home from school. …

This is just a thought: I wonder if the man who was parked along U.S. Highway 21, intently watching the younger kids as they came home from school, is the same man who tried to sell the family life insurance. If they are the same man, then it sounds to me like he may have been a pedophile who was stalking children. The ages of the children (Maurice 14, Martha 12, Louis 9, Jennie 8 and Betty 5) who disappeared fit a pedophiles’ desire for their sexual attraction to prepubescent children.

[twinsrwe]

http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=99826.0

Anthony, thank you for posting this link. While doing some research I found the same account written by Mary Ann on another web site, which has a lot more information in it. I had to do one of these, , when I read the following information (Underlining is mine.):

… On Christmas Eve night during the year of 1945, our home was set afire. There were nine children in the house at the time, four escaped from the burning building. My parents also escaped. I ran to a neighbour's house to have her call the fire department. She said the operator did not answer when she tried to put the call through to the fire department. A passing motorist called the Fayetteville Fire Department. Fayetteville is the nearest small town to our former residence. The Fire Chief answered the telephone. When he was told that our house was burning, he said, "We know it." This was at two o'clock A.M. He and the rest of the fire department arrived at the scene of the fire at 8 o'clock A.M., that same morning. The fire dept in the town of Fayetteville is located only two and one half miles away. …

… We asked the Prosecuting Attorney to call in some people who were considered suspects in this case. He said he could not question these people because they were personal friends of his. At another time he said, "Today they burned your house, but tomorrow they may burn mine and I have children too." …

See more at: http://tinyurl.com/nasey2b

That last line reminds me of the Jessica Chambers murder. In Ali Alsanai’s interview with Fox 13 News he made the statement of: “Can I be honest with you, It’s not just threatening me, it’s threatening everybody, cause whoever did it, he, he, he could do it to somebody else.”

[Aamartin]

There seems to be a great deal of interest in this case-- I am surprised there was never a book or documentary.

[MysteryReader]

I'll have to research this case again, with all of the links given. :-) A side note- we live in the country with my in-laws. They never lock their doors (at night, when they go out, etc.) and it's a little nerve racking, even after living here for a while. They leave keys in the car, too. When we had a fire here about 2 years ago, the keys in the car is what saved 2. I had to grab mine to move my car. When it's just me and hubby, you bet those doors get locked!

[Franz]

I think with the new technology of today it should not be difficult to know if the young man in the photo is the same Louis.

[Franz]

There seems to be a great deal of interest in this case-- I am surprised there was never a book or documentary.

It's strange indeed.

[Franz]

"A couple of years after the tragedy, Mr. Sodder saw a photo of school children in New York and was certain that Betty was one of the children in the photograph. He drove to Manhattan to see for himself but was never allowed to see the child."

If I am a father, I can much better understand Mr. Sodder's pain. So if I were the father of that girl and if she was not the missing Betty, I would have allowed Mr. Sodder to see my child and speak to her in order to ascertain himself that she was not Betty.

What would you have done in this case?

(According the report, it seems that Mr. Sodder did find that girl's address, but was not allowed to see her. Just incredible!)

[twinsrwe]

I'll have to research this case again, with all of the links given. :-) A side note- we live in the country with my in-laws. They never lock their doors (at night, when they go out, etc.) and it's a little nerve racking, even after living here for a while. They leave keys in the car, too. When we had a fire here about 2 years ago, the keys in the car is what saved 2. I had to grab mine to move my car. When it's just me and hubby, you bet those doors get locked!

I know what you mean, Mystery. I grew up on a dairy farm, and my parents never locked their doors and always left their keys in the car.

Several years ago I lived in a large city, and learned to always lock the doors to my house, as well as my car doors. One day I went home to the farm to visit with my mother and sister. At the time I was driving a Ford Mustang, and out of habit, I locked the doors of my car when I got there. My received a great deal of 'ribbing' from my two brothers who had stopped in to see me.

So, the next time I went to see my family, I forced myself to leave my car doors unlocked. When I got ready to leave that day, my car was gone!!! I went into a panic, and my brothers laughed their behinds off. My twin brother, came over to me, and said, "Look over there, I thought it was hungry, so I turned to out to pasture." He had driven my Mustang, down a small hill into a valley and up onto the hillside, which you can plainly see from my mother's yard. I said, "Does my car look like a horse?" He laughed and said, "No, but it did look hungry to me!"

Brothers, ya gotta loved 'um!!!

[twinsrwe]

I think with the new technology of today it should not be difficult to know if the young man in the photo is the same Louis.

I agree, Franz.

[twinsrwe]

There seems to be a great deal of interest in this case-- I am surprised there was never a book or documentary.

It's strange indeed.

It's almost too strange to be true!

[twinsrwe]

"A couple of years after the tragedy, Mr. Sodder saw a photo of school children in New York and was certain that Betty was one of the children in the photograph. He drove to Manhattan to see for himself but was never allowed to see the child."

If I am a father, I can much better understand Mr. Sodder's pain. So if I were the father of that girl and if she was not the missing Betty, I would have allowed Mr. Sodder to see my child and speak to her in order to ascertain himself that she was not Betty.

What would you have done in this case?

(According the report, it seems that Mr. Sodder did find that girl's address, but was not allowed to see her. Just incredible!)

Really? That is unbelievable! Franz, do you happen to have the source for the information you posted? I'd like to read it if you do.

[debbiediablo]

"A couple of years after the tragedy, Mr. Sodder saw a photo of school children in New York and was certain that Betty was one of the children in the photograph. He drove to Manhattan to see for himself but was never allowed to see the child."

If I am a father, I can much better understand Mr. Sodder's pain. So if I were the father of that girl and if she was not the missing Betty, I would have allowed Mr. Sodder to see my child and speak to her in order to ascertain himself that she was not Betty.

What would you have done in this case?

(According the report, it seems that Mr. Sodder did find that girl's address, but was not allowed to see her. Just incredible!)

I totally agree, Franz. The only reason I can think of to not permit Mr. Sodder to see the child would be to keep the child from realizing her father was still alive.

I, too, am surprised this hasn't been investigated, written about, become the subject of a film. Reading the links that Twins and Anthony have added (thanks!) makes this sound like a conspiracy. I need to check out the history of West Virginia coal mining at the time. Plus some who can read and write Italian (Franz??? ) could possibly find the records of Mr. Sodder and his brother before they emigrated to the US and of the brother thereafter. The brother immediately returned to Italy which seems odd.

Interesting that the phone worked at midnight but not later when trying to reach the fire department.

[debbiediablo]

I'll have to research this case again, with all of the links given. :-) A side note- we live in the country with my in-laws. They never lock their doors (at night, when they go out, etc.) and it's a little nerve racking, even after living here for a while. They leave keys in the car, too. When we had a fire here about 2 years ago, the keys in the car is what saved 2. I had to grab mine to move my car. When it's just me and hubby, you bet those doors get locked!

I know what you mean, Mystery. I grew up on a dairy farm, and my parents never locked their doors and always left their keys in the car.

Several years ago I lived in a large city, and learned to always lock the doors to my house, as well as my car doors. One day I went home to the farm to visit with my mother and sister. At the time I was driving a Ford Mustang, and out of habit, I locked the doors of my car when I got there. My received a great deal of 'ribbing' from my two brothers who had stopped in to see me.

So, the next time I went to see my family, I forced myself to leave my car doors unlocked. When I got ready to leave that day, my car was gone!!! I went into a panic, and my brothers laughed their behinds off. My twin brother, came over to me, and said, "Look over there, I thought it was hungry, so I turned to out to pasture." He had driven my Mustang, down a small hill into a valley and up onto the hillside, which you can plainly see from my mother's yard. I said, "Does my car look like a horse?" He laughed and said, "No, but it did look hungry to me!"

Brothers, ya gotta loved 'um!!!

This is very funny....

[Franz]

According to a source (see below) the original family name of "Sodder" is "Soddu" in Italian. And the unique Soddu family in Sicily is in... Palermo!

http://unsolvedmysteries.wikia.com/wiki/Sodder_Family

http://www.cognomix.it/mappe-dei-cognomi-italiani/SODDU

[Franz]

twinsrwe, the information I quoted (New York) can be found in many articles about the case.

[MysteryReader]

I'll have to research this case again, with all of the links given. :-) A side note- we live in the country with my in-laws. They never lock their doors (at night, when they go out, etc.) and it's a little nerve racking, even after living here for a while. They leave keys in the car, too. When we had a fire here about 2 years ago, the keys in the car is what saved 2. I had to grab mine to move my car. When it's just me and hubby, you bet those doors get locked!

I know what you mean, Mystery. I grew up on a dairy farm, and my parents never locked their doors and always left their keys in the car.

Several years ago I lived in a large city, and learned to always lock the doors to my house, as well as my car doors. One day I went home to the farm to visit with my mother and sister. At the time I was driving a Ford Mustang, and out of habit, I locked the doors of my car when I got there. My received a great deal of 'ribbing' from my two brothers who had stopped in to see me.

So, the next time I went to see my family, I forced myself to leave my car doors unlocked. When I got ready to leave that day, my car was gone!!! I went into a panic, and my brothers laughed their behinds off. My twin brother, came over to me, and said, "Look over there, I thought it was hungry, so I turned to out to pasture." He had driven my Mustang, down a small hill into a valley and up onto the hillside, which you can plainly see from my mother's yard. I said, "Does my car look like a horse?" He laughed and said, "No, but it did look hungry to me!"

Brothers, ya gotta loved 'um!!!

Hahaha! I can imagine! I do leave my car unlocked but I have the keys with me. Not that it will make any difference to anyone who wanted to steal it.

[twinsrwe]

Debbie and Mystery, I’m glad you two liked my Mustang story. I didn't think it was very funny at the time it occurred, but I do now; it’s become one of those little endearing things that my twin pulled on me. My twin is something else; he is always coming up with 'cute' ideas.

[Aamartin]

I emerged from the 'super center' once and could not find my car. I was CONVINCED it was stolen so I called the police. They came and I was sitting in the patrol car, describing the make/model of the car-- and I said, 'it's like that one.... umm. Is it that one' Parked right in the vicinity I said I was in!

[twinsrwe]

Oh no, Anthony, how embarrassing!

[Aamartin]

I have been fascinated reading other discussions about this case and quickly noticed there are a lot of people who believe things to be fact that could not (seem to) be backed up with fact...

Apparently Mr. Sodder bulldozed the sight days after the fire.... Some speculated that he was trying to conceal evidence. IMO, he was not. I do not believe he or his wife-- had anything to do with the fire or any of the deaths and/or disappearances of the children.

People do odd things out of grief, especially fresh grief.

When my mother died, I went sort of crazy. Spending far too much money on psychics (both in person and telephone consultations) and other odd things like Tarot cards, etc... All sorts of supernatural stuff-- as well as books about loss and grief....

Those poor parents believed their children were alive. And IMO it was because they so desperately needed to.

[twinsrwe]

twinsrwe, the information I quoted (New York) can be found in many articles about the case.

OK, I found it! I must have been reading too fast, or I was interrupted and missed it when I went back to finish reading the article.

[debbiediablo]

Franz, is there any way to check on possible reasons why the father would have emigrated without any other members of his family? That's unusual, especially since his brother came over with him and then immediately returned. There seems to be a BIG ??? around this and whether it was connected to the kids' disappearance. Sodder was reticent about his youth. I'm wondering if Sodder was trying to avoid possible criminal charges or perhaps ran afoul of Sicily's Cosa Nostra.

The reports of seeing the five kids in a restaurant with Italian speaking adults is interesting, keeping in mind that eye witness testimony is often not reliable. So is the possible connection to Palermo.

The fact that Mrs. Sodder did not make public all that she knew about the purported picture of Louis because she feared for his life doesn't quite make sense. By that time he would have been a self-sufficient adult. Nor does Mr. Sodder traveling to New York and then not seeing the child he thought was Martha. Again, there seems to be an unnamed fear or perhaps it had a name that needed to remain secret. Certainly unnamed fear would be understandable given the family's history.

I also wonder if the intent was to kill the children or to remove the children and then kill the adults in an "accidental" fire. Most vengeance in 1945 did not include the death of wife and children. Plus, if the purpose was to teach a lesson then making it look like an accident would be counter productive. Plus there is no evidence that Sodder connected it with anyone or anything.

There was a Cosa Nostra presence in Fairmont and Boomer, WV. Fayetteville is 30 minutes from Boomer and 90 minutes from Fairmont. Sodder was an independent contractor. For sure, the labor disputes in WV had a long and bloody history. Mussolini died eight months prior to the fire, seemingly long enough to make Sodder's criticism of him a moot point.

Phone + fire department + police + lack of FBI + odd sitings + unburned organ and bones = Conspiracy theory.

[Franz]

It would be a hard work, Debbie.

[MysteryReader]

I first heard/read about this case here: http://www.defrostingcoldcases.com/case ... -children/