A view of the Churchill house

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 8:36 am

I don't know if 1910 is an accurate date for the photo, but I can't date the automobile properly to argue the point. Possibly the 1920's?

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:45 am

I agree Harry. The Chagnon House was considerably north of the behind the barn area. I will have to snoop around in the street directory for several years. Perhaps this was a small house which burned down. It would have had to been constructed on part of what was that old orchard, but of course there will be a record if any lot was subdivided. Although this is not a pressing issue- I have a great curiosity about the neighborhood over the decades after 1892.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:51 am

I believe- and Len concurs, these two houses on Third Street, on the left side of this photo were not 1892 structures. The area where the orchard would have been is also now much narrower between the two houses. I would guess some lot lines changed, or there was some sort of subdivision before these current two houses were built. There is now a one-storey low garage building directly behind the Borden house fence, in between these two houses. I suspect we will solve this mystery before too long!

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:40 am

The license plate on the car in the photo indicates 1917, 1919, 1921, 1923, or 1924. I can't quite make out the year at the bottom, it reads "MASS.19..". These years, the license plates were light lettering on dark background, and the plates were issued new each year, alternating light on dark, dark on light. In subsequent years, the plates read "MASS. (line or fish) 19.." across the bottom. In previous years, the plates had "MASS." and "19.." written vertically on the left and right edges of the plates.

As near as I can see, the year is 1923, or 1924. The third and first digits in the year on the plate don't seem to match, the third digit looks broader than a 1, so it is probably a 2. The fourth digit also doesn't match the first, so it is probably a 3 or 4. To my eye, there is an angularity about the fourth digit, so I would guess it to be a 4. I would guess the photo was taken in 1924 rather than in 1910.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:22 pm

Shelley @ Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:51 am wrote:I believe- and Len concurs, these two houses on Third Street, on the left side of this photo were not 1892 structures. The area where the orchard would have been is also now much narrower between the two houses. I would guess some lot lines changed, or there was some sort of subdivision before these current two houses were built. There is now a one-storey low garage building directly behind the Borden house fence, in between these two houses. I suspect we will solve this mystery before too long!

I think that house in the allegedly 1910 photo abuts the edge of what was the Chagnon property, spans the driveway, and a portion of what was the orchard.

Yooper, I agree in that I think the photo is later than 1910 and you may have zeroed right in on the year at 1924. My copy of that photo I had labeled "1910s", ie: not a specific year. I undoubtedly got that from the person who originally posted it. Have no idea where the year came from.

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:34 pm

Here's the source for the license plate information:

http://www.w-a.com/maplate.htm

If Shelley wants to research street directories, it may help narrow the search to begin with 1924 and work backward from there.

I'm not able to pick out the flat roof of the original Chagnon house in the photo, although it is difficult to see within the narrow space between the porch in the foreground and the edge of the barn further back. I agree, it was probably taken after the Chagnon house was torn down.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 1:38 pm

Good- now to hit the library- maybe Michael B will get a chance to check out the 1920 street directories. I am not in Fall River until Sunday and I am not sure it is open then.

The big shingled house on Third Street has a Christmas display which must be seen to be believed- even the ground is covered with white plastic. Today we did get about an inch of snow, which has quickly melted.

That structure behind the barn looks too tall to be a garage or barn of any sort- it must be a residence of some kind.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 2:51 pm

Yes Shelley, by Michael B I take it you are speaking of me, No? If so I also am not home and will not be for another week or so. I'm in the Florida sun Lounging on my boat soaking in the sun in 70+ temp. at a marina in Cape Canaveral; not missing the snow either.

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:28 pm

Yooper @ Mon Dec 04, 2006 12:40 pm wrote:The license plate on the car in the photo indicates 1917, 1919, 1921, 1923, or 1924. I can't quite make out the year at the bottom, it reads "MASS.19..". These years, the license plates were light lettering on dark background, and the plates were issued new each year, alternating light on dark, dark on light. In subsequent years, the plates read "MASS. (line or fish) 19.." across the bottom. In previous years, the plates had "MASS." and "19.." written vertically on the left and right edges of the plates.

As near as I can see, the year is 1923, or 1924. The third and first digits in the year on the plate don't seem to match, the third digit looks broader than a 1, so it is probably a 2. The fourth digit also doesn't match the first, so it is probably a 3 or 4. To my eye, there is an angularity about the fourth digit, so I would guess it to be a 4. I would guess the photo was taken in 1924 rather than in 1910.

I say the year was 1927. That was when Edmund Peason took that photo for his publication with the chapter on the Bordens. (AS I remember it.)

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 8:50 pm

Soaking up the sun Michael? Well, frigid Fall River is waiting- we're all in our union suits huddled up to the woodstove with three furry hound dogs for warmth (a.k.a. a three dog night). Inquiring minds want to know about The Mystery House-enough of this wasting away in Margaritaville!

1bigsteve · Post by **1bigsteve** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:17 pm

Shelley @ Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:50 pm wrote:Soaking up the sun Michael? Well, frigid Fall River is waiting- we're all in our union suits huddled up to the woodstove with three furry hound dogs for warmth (a.k.a. a three dog night). Inquiring minds want to know about The Mystery House-enough of this wasting away in Margaritaville!

Don't get too comfy around that stove, Shelley. Has the chimney been swept out lately? A hot spark can ignite that creosote and reduce Lizzie's house to a burned-out cinder.

Have you got hot buttered popcorn along with some hot chocolate? Pumpkin pie with whipped cream? Egg nog? Hhhmmm... I can smell it now! I can be over in say 10 minutes?

-1bigsteve (o: