Lizzie on Montel

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 9:54 am

I was with Shelley yesterday and was told there was a film crew from
the Montel Williams show filmng the house for a segment on his show.
LeeAnn Is going to New York to be on his show.
I'll get more info on this at the gathering on when she is going and when
we might expect it to air

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:32 pm

The crew was great- the "B" role of the interiors was completed finally by 7 p.m. and all of our interviews. Samantha, Colleen, LeeAnn and I were interviewed last in the day, the house guests were a little shy but one lady from Ohio agreed to say a few words for the camera. Of course most of this stuff gets left on the cutting room floor. I heard 2 possibilities for air date- either this Wednesday or Halloween. I have a few photos to post . It was a busy weekend with many guests, the taping, a Red Hat Society tea and 2 busloads of visitors today. The foliage is at peak and is breath-taking, so the "Leaf-Peepers" are also stopping to take a peep at Lizzie.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:51 pm

LeeAnn will appear also with reknown psychic Sylvia Browne on the show. http://www.sylvia.org/home/index.cfm

Naturally this particular show is focusing on the paranormal and the house- and Halloween fun spooky places.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 11:40 pm

A photo of the crew, and LeeAnn waiting for her close-up in a scene walking up the front stairs with a hatchet.

This dress I had made in 1982 -can't believe I was ever this thin!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:54 am

I'll bet that production crew had a BLAST!

Lee-ann dressed up and on a cell phone is pretty funny!

Thanks!

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:16 pm

LeeAnn you look very pretty. Sometimes I wish those styles would come back. When I used to wear my long dress to the Civil War reenactments with my kids I always used to feel so feminine. And guys would behave differently. They would jump forward to help me wtep over rocks, etc. Whereas, if I had been wearing jeans, they probably would let me trip all over myself.

augusta · Post by **augusta** » Sun Oct 21, 2007 4:49 pm

Thanks for posting the nice photos, Shelley.

Lee Ann, your costume is gorgeous - and so are you.

Wow! Sylvia Browne! I can't wait to hear what she has to say about the house.

What would Lizzie be saying on her cell phone?

"No, Em! I told you to wait until you hear it from Bowen before heading back!"

"Hello, Winwards? I'd like to pre-plan two funerals ..."

"I'm glad you answered, Uncle John. There's some people here who said they would be willing - and able - to shoot Mrs. Borden and Father. ... That's true, it'd make too much noise, and we might have to give them a cut of the inheritance. ... Yes, it's much better to wait."

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Oct 22, 2007 12:56 am

Thank you Sherry for a small taste of your wonderful humor just prior to the publishing of the upcoming Hatchet, with your "Dear Abby!" I always look forward to that every issue!

NESpinster · Post by **NESpinster** » Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:01 am

So do we know exactly when this episode is going to air?

I would love to see it!!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Wed Oct 24, 2007 10:27 pm

Looks like it will air Halloween day. I believe the show is on at 4 p.m.
LeeAnn was in New York today to do the taping. I hope none of us come off sounding like looneytunes. We all gave long interviews and what usually gets left in or edited around are the off the cuff comments, or stuff out of context.

augusta · Post by **augusta** » Fri Oct 26, 2007 9:35 am

Oh boy! I can't wait! I'd think Lee Ann was a great guest on the show. Montel is on at noon EST, but maybe he's on more than once a day. I don't watch it.

Tina-Kate · Post by **Tina-Kate** » Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:30 am

I have Montel listed as being at 10 a.m. weekdays out of one of the upstate NY stations...so everybody better check your local listings ahead of time!

I must remember to set the VCR!

augusta · Post by **augusta** » Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:20 pm

Ya know, I was in South Carolina when I caught it at noon. Maybe it's on a different time in Detroit.

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 11:36 am

The show will air here this afternoon at 2.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:44 pm

Drat, Montel Williams' show is not shown in my part of S.C.

Would have liked to have seen Lee-ann.

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 1:32 pm

What they've shown of her and said about the house (so far) is great...there just wasn't enough!

Tina-Kate · Post by **Tina-Kate** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:14 pm

Hmmm...I was afraid of that.

I did a trial run on Monday as I haven't used my VCR to record in a dog's age.

So, I checked out the Monday show of Montel. I noticed there was a LOT of commercials & they fell into the trap so many of those shows do in trying to cover far too much & too many people in just an hour so you hardly get anything of substance at all.

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:04 pm

I didn't pay much attention to the time element, but I'd say they might have spent what, ten minutes at most talking to Lee Ann? It was probably slightly less than that though.

JoAnne · Post by **JoAnne** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:22 pm

Barbara and I just watch the Montel Show. First let me say, LeeAnn looked Maaaaarvelous!. But I was disappointed on the shortness of the discussion and no Shelly in the house. It really was a segment on Sylvia Brown.

Oh well, "HAPPY HALLOWEEN!" Enjoy.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:26 pm

Yes Lee-ann looked great and she had a lot of class.
I think she acquitted herself well after Ms. Browne claimed Lizzie was at the House.
Lee-ann was a bit surprised, yet quietly acknowledged that Lizzie "passes through."
And Ms. Browne got the hint I noticed.

stuartwsa · Post by **stuartwsa** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 7:05 pm

Th B&B segment should have been much longer. Lee-Ann looked wonderful and came across very well. I was very touched and intrigued by her account of being in the guest room, and feeling a pressure on her chest, and then being wracked by sobs and the feeling of overwhelming grief. I would like to hear more about that incident.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:30 am

I have never met Lee-ann, however, she presented herself in a very professional manner and her appearance was great. I thought the B&B segment was much too short!!! I, and I'm sure everyone else, was left with several questions.

Who are the children that Sylvia names as Irene, Henry, and Sally? BTW: I was surprised that Lee-ann said she knew there was a Sally. I had always thought that these children were Ladowick Borden and his 2nd wife Eliza Darling's children. In the following link, Kat, names their children as Maria, Eliza Ann, and Holden: viewtopic.php?t=2800 - Does this mean that the children inhabiting 92 Second Street are not Ladowick and Eliza Darling's children? I was quite disappointed that Sylvia names these children, then leaves us to wonder whose children they were; what happened to them and why they are entities at 92 Second Street.

Kat, I also caught Lee-ann's surprised look when Sylvia claimed that Lizzie was at the House. I would have liked an explanation of how and why Sylvia came up with her claim that she (not actually naming Lizzie) did it, she was bi-polar and she was crazy. Sylvia throws these accusations out to us, then leaves us hanging in la-la land. I would have liked for Sylvia to tell us how she (Lizzie) did it and what happened to the murder weapon as well as her clothing. Also why she feels Lizzie inhabits or passes through the house from time to time.

Something that Sylvia said, threw up a red flag for me, which lead me to question the accuracy of her psychic abilities. After Lee-ann had finished telling about the experience she had with Abby in the guest room, that Stuartwsa mentioned above, Sylvia stated, "I would try to explain to her that her daughter was crazy, that she didn't mean to do it." Montel says, "Is that what's keeping her there?" To which Sylvia simply says, "huh, ha." If Sylvia is an accurate psychic, then why would she refer to Lizzie as being Abby's daughter. Furthermore, I would have liked for Sylvia to tell us how she came to the conclusion that Lizzie didn't mean to do it and exactly what did happen on the morning of August 4th, 1892. Again, she left us hanging.

I found the following web sites that you may find interesting:

Sylvia Browne, is she a psychic Guru or a Quack:
http://atheism.about.com/b/2006/02/04/s ... -quack.htm
and
http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/browne.html

This web site analyzes Sylvia Browne's inaccuracies:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... _n19170678
and
http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/home/

Sylvia Browne attempts to silence this web site:
http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/article ... ence.shtml

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:57 am

One compound question occurred to me as I watched the program: What did Sylvia know, and when did she know it? It was pretty obvious that she’s done at least a little reading on the subject – enough to make herself appear to be speaking knowledgably to about the Bordens and/or Borden murders. The “Bi–polar” rabbit I’d love to know which hat she pulled that out of. It’s basically the same as the epilepsy contention put up many years ago. Okay – show me the money. Where’s your credible evidence?

The daughter business is passable, if only for one or two reasons: Whatever she was in legal reality, Abby Borden was in all likelihood the only “mother” – the dominant mother figure in the Borden household - that Lizzie ever knew, up through her formative years. Mistake though it is, that error deserves just as much slack as does the error made by Medical Examiner Dolan at the time of Andrew Borden’s autopsy: As far as Dolan and the record were concerned Andrew Borden was 70 years of age at the time of his decease. Of course this is technically incorrect, but it makes little difference in the end.

The thing that perked up my ears was this: Sylvia Browne seemed to imply (at least as I heard her and understand the English language) that Lizzie’s is a constant presence at No. 92. To me, that assertion – provided I understood her meaning – is nothing but hogwash. Logic doesn’t always apply, but I do have to ask: Why would Lizzie be a constant presence in a home she did not like, did everything she could to avoid? LeeAnn’s comment that Lizzie’s spirit “passes through” makes far more sense, particularly within the context of what we know.

Sylvia has her schtik just like Yuri Geller had his. I’m glad she wasn’t the reason I decided to watch the show!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:46 am

Lizzie didn't like the place alive, and I am sure she wouldn't be caught dead there!

Sylvia also said Abby fell to her knees before she hit the floor- another not-so-surprising non-revelation. Still, it was great to see the house on TV twice today and lovely exposure for us all in all. Dr. Betty Mitchell, who teaches a class in Lizzie at U Mass Dartmouth was there today with her freshman girls, and said what most of us think here- the case and the history is interesting enough-all the paranormal is just fun stuff for some who want it. Len Rebello gave a special tour for the class. Okay, I am not a "believer" but I must say- almost NONE of my cellar pix came out- all were covered in a white smokey filmy miasma. Hmmmm.....

It was nice to see Debbie Shannon Valentine today in the barn with Dee and Len. Debbie was featured on many of the early documentaries and was among one the first women researchers consulted on the case.

Len gave a special tour for Dr. Mitchell's class- the cellar was a big hit!

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:14 am

I understand that was what she was meaning too, along with Abby being there.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:23 am

I agree, Shelley. Lizzie would have little reason to be there. Lee-ann's comment of her "passing through" once in a while is probably true (if you believe in such things).

Lizzie couldn't move out fast enough. Can we blame her. Guilty or innocent that house was a constant reminder of something that would destroy the rest of her life.

Tina-Kate · Post by **Tina-Kate** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:28 am

Great pictures as always, Shelley!

Lee-Ann was a cutie! I was most interested to find out she has also had an experience of overwhelming emotion...altho she had it in the guestroom, whereas I had it in the sitting room.

Who is Sylvia Browne? This is the 1st I've heard of her. Her book, frankly, looks like another daVinci Code spin-off.

One thing that really caught my attention is that she associated the name "Irene" with the house. Back in 1990, my (true) psychic friend picked up the name Irene as associated with 92. Mind you, she got the number on Second Street wrong (I think she said 86). Anyway...my friend did not realize she was talking about Lizzie Borden when she told me a great deal of stuff about it. She also said the name "Len". This was about 9 years before I ever heard of Len Rebello. I wrote down all that she said & kept it for years. Alas, I lost it during a move.

Anyway, I was annoyed SB kept interrupting Lee-Ann! I guess all of us who saw it were watching it for Lee-Ann and NOT SB. I also picked up on the daughter vs stepdaughter slip and SB's assertion that Lizzie haunts 92.

One thing I do not discount, however, is the bipolar disorder, which I think is quite possible.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:14 am

Sylvia Browne has been "on the circuit" for a long, long time. She has written about a jillion books on every possible psychic topic. I just read one on various personality traits- I think she said there are 47 "types". She is most famous for looking at a total stranger and telling them something personal in a "cold reading". Which is usually somewhat upsetting for the poor person on the other end! How acurate she is , is hard to say as some of her pronouncements are pretty vague and generic, like "Go see a doctor". I find her a little "in your face", sort of show biz in her outspoken way, and she clearly enjoys her celebrity.
Most polite people, (like LeeAnn) get overpowered by Sylvia's dominating personality and rapid fire conversation. Yes, hours and hours of good footage was left on the cutting room floor- all so we could hear MORE of Sylvia. Sigh.. SHOW BIZ!

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:53 am

Sylvia appears to be quite full of herself; this was so obvious when she was clapping her hands along with the audience while walking out on the set after Montel introduced her. Jeeez! This was an immediate turn-off, for me.

Thank you Shelley, for verifying that hours of footage was cut out of this show. I had the distinct impression, while watching the show, that a lot of information was edited out of the B&B segment; it just seemed choppy to me.

Tina-Kate, I was also annoyed that Sylvia kept interrupting Lee-ann - I found this very rude and irritating on her part. I also found it unsettling the way Sylvia looked at Lee-ann when she was telling about her encounter with Abby in the guest bedroom. It appeared to me, that Sylvia found Lee-ann's story boring. I would love to get Lee-ann's thoughts and reactions to this showing.

As for the daughter vs stepdaughter slip-up; this is a basic fact of the relationship between Abby and Lizzie. I find it difficult to put any faith in a psychic who can not get a simple fact, such as this, straight. Sylvia made several comments without any evidence, whatsoever, to back-up her statements - Lizzie being presence at 92 Second Street, Lizzie was Bi-Polar, Lizzie was crazy, there are 3 children presence, etc, etc. Are we to believe her just because she says it is so? I don't think so - show me the proof, some evidence. (Tina-Kate, I mean no disrespect for your psychic friend. I found what you said she related to you quite interesting. I'm talking about physic's who make statements on a TV show, without backing-up their so called facts.) I would like to know if Sylvia has ever physically been inside of 92 Second Street.

I guess, I don't understand why the B&B segment was even presented on this show, it was quite obvious that the show was all about Sylvia, not the hauntings at the B&B. This is very unfortunate, since it would have been a dynamite show if they had stuck to the hauntings of the B&B.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:59 am

Shelley @ Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:46 am wrote: ... Sylvia also said Abby fell to her knees before she hit the floor- another not-so-surprising non-revelation. ...

Hmmm, I don't recall Sylvia saying this on the show. I taped the show and have played it several times, but still can't find where she said this.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:01 pm

"the show was all about Sylvia,"

Uh, yep- that's about the size of it. LeeAnn gave some really great stuff on the house, Samantha, Colleen and I all did over an hour each of interviews. Nine years' worth of information about the history of the B&B and the case, as well as guest experiences were relayed, and we got The Sylvia Browne Hour. Still, that is par for the course. I hope people will be curious enough to forget Sylvia and come have a real taste of the scene of the crime for themselves. I would bet they will!

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:32 pm

That is so very sad, Shelley. To think they had nine years B&B history in their hands, not to mention the interviews, etc., and they let it go down the drain for SYLVIA. Jeeez!!! Well, that's show biz for ya!!!

However, I think you are making a pretty safe bet here.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:39 pm

I'm beginning to be glad the show was not carried on my satellite TV system. Sounds like it was frustrating. Oh so typical of those talk shows. Never expect anything deep.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:00 pm

You're right, Harry. It was a very disappointing show, to say the least. Believe me, you didn't miss much. I was left with more questions than I had before this show was viewed. Unfortunately, we will never have the opportunity to obtain any answers to the questions Sylvia left us with. It made no sense, whatsoever, to present the B&B segment and have Lee-ann as a guest on the show, just to cut her short. I feel bad for Lee-ann - what a waste of her time.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 2:44 pm

Shelley @ Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:14 am wrote:Sylvia Browne has been "on the circuit" for a long, long time. She has written about a jillion books on every possible psychic topic. I just read one on various personality traits- I think she said there are 47 "types". She is most famous for looking at a total stranger and telling them something personal in a "cold reading". Which is usually somewhat upsetting for the poor person on the other end! How acurate she is , is hard to say as some of her pronouncements are pretty vague and generic, like "Go see a doctor". I find her a little "in your face", sort of show biz in her outspoken way, and she clearly enjoys her celebrity.
Most polite people, (like LeeAnn) get overpowered by Sylvia's dominating personality and rapid fire conversation. Yes, hours and hours of good footage was left on the cutting room floor- all so we could hear MORE of Sylvia. Sigh.. SHOW BIZ!

I remember reading somwhere that she is a freud and has be suited a coupe of times.
Don't know how true this is, but just something I remember reading.

stuartwsa · Post by **stuartwsa** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:17 pm

I get bad vibes watching Sylvia Browne. She reminds me of some old movie chorine that has gotten so tough over the years that she is no longer vulnerable, like Lucille Ball or Rose Marie.
(She especially reminds me of the latter!)

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:11 pm

The following link contains an interview with Gary Dufresne, Sylvia Browne's first husband, and the webmaster of the Stop Sylvia Browne web site; I found it quite interesting: http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/article ... snes.shtml

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 8:31 pm

Stuart. Rose Marie is at least entertaining in a harmless fashion - or used to be anyway.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:12 pm

That was a VERY interesting website about Sylvia. Can't say I am surprised.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 6:42 am

I agree, Shelley, it is an interesting web site. I wasn't a bit surprised, either.

Tina-Kate · Post by **Tina-Kate** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 8:36 am

Thanks for the link.

Stuff like that really bothers me. Frauds & tricksters not only do damage to people who have honest abilities, but they can hurt so many people.

My friend was the real thing. She never once took any money for "seeing" & in one case may have actually saved the life of a friend of one of our co-workers.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:23 am

You're welcome Tine-Kate. I agree with you - frauds do a lot of damage and don't care who they hurt. Their only goal is MONEY.

Your friend, on the other hand, is a winner.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:45 am

There are many YouTube videos on her. She apparently is a regular on that show as in most of them she appears with Montel Williams.

I was hoping the latest video was posted as I would have like to have seen Lee-ann. No luck.

http://youtube.com/results?search_query ... rch=Search

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:02 am

I was trying to find it too, Harry. Maybe it will get there eventually. Some of the house gang taped a copy for me. According to that stop-sylvia website, she has lied about her academic credentials-not to mention using very flattering younger pictures of herself on her books, photoshopped to a faretheewell. Years ago I used to "read" Tarot cards for fun and entertainment for friends at parties- on the nature of parlor games. Some of the "pros" used to tell me tricks to employ when reading. Watch the eyes, particularly the pupils of the person you are reading for. If they dilate, and the eyes sparkle and become animated, you are babbling something close to the truth-so keep on going! Another trick is not to let the person talk or question- just keep making pronouncements. Aggressive posture, taking control of the body space, being dominant in voice and attitude also keeps the "readee" in the submissive role. It is an art form mostly that the big bucks "seers" know how to work. I always managed to see money, good news, and tall handsome strangers in my readings for people!

It is sad so many people today spend so much money and so much faith and time listening to these quacks. I have yet to meet The Real Deal.

Tina-Kate · Post by **Tina-Kate** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:05 am

I'll tell the story of that potential life saving.

We worked for a new home developer & my friend worked out at one of our housing sites, so was not in the corporate office very often. Every once in a while when she came in, she would go around asking people if they knew "such & such a person". She'd keep going until she found the person she had a message for.

I forget the name so I'll say "Pete". She came in asking everyone if they knew Pete. She failed several times until she got to the girl sitting next to me. She piped up & said Pete was her brother's best friend.

My friend grabbed her hand & said that Pete liked to drive west out of town a lot having fun. The girl said that was true. "Well, he drinks when he does it and he's been lucky so far, but his luck is over. He better stop right now & I mean it or it's NOT GOING TO BE SO FUNNY. You tell him about this right away & if he scoffs, ask him about the tickets and the kite."

The next day the girl came in astounded. She had seen Pete. He had thought these joy rides were no big deal & laughed at first...then he went pale when she mentioned the tickets & the kite. Turned out in his trunk he had not only a kite, but a pile of unpaid parking tickets he'd told no one about! He stopped his joy rides.

That, I think is THE REAL DEAL.

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 11:43 am

Your comment there re Tarot Shelley reminded me of something Mr. Holmes of Baker Street often said - about how we sometimes see, but do not observe. Know your victim I suppose you could say, eh?

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:37 pm

Funny, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, one of my literary heroes, was a clever man, and his mentor, Dr. Bell (inspiration for Sherlock Holmes) based his success on careful observation of his patients and their appearance. Still, Doyle went on to become a great devotee of the paranormal and spiritualism -even getting involved in that ridiculous Cottingly Fairy Hoax and proclaiming his support for these creatures. The movie, Fairy Tale was based on this true life incident. The deductive method has much to offer, and careful observation, be it cigarette ash or a footprint is the basis for modern day crime scene investigation. Eliminate all the obvious, and whatever remains, no matter how unusual, will be the truth. I am reading The Secret Life of Houdini, who made a life's work out of exposing the many charlatans preying on bereaved, desperate people. This book suggests Houdini was murdered by spiritualists who had sent numerous death threats. Houdini was a great threat to them who turned a buck on the backs of sad, hopeless people. Prof. Starrs, last I heard was looking into the Houdini case with view to exhumation. His peritonitus may not have been the cause of death from that blow to the abdomen- it may have been stricnine poisoning. Fascinating. I admire officer Medley enormously for his efforts at observation. I also suspect more pairs of eyes saw PLENTY on August 4th-not all said what they saw-or suspected.

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:40 pm

Shelley, thanks! I was looking for a good book to read. The one on Houdini sounds great.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:44 pm

Kalush and Sloman are the authors- Amazon has it used for 8 dollars.

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Fri Nov 02, 2007 12:54 pm

Yup yup. Already ordered it from them. Thanks.