Hi:
I'm new to the forum and trying to learn a little about Lizzie's post-trial life, and her attitude towards her notoriety. Namely, is there any evidence that she enjoyed the stir she caused (even though she was acquitted and always claimed she was innocent)? I've heard that she bought a huge house and stayed in Fall River, but I was wondering if any could supply any details about whether she felt embarassed by her ordeal, or whether she sort of enjoyed her notoriety....
thanks!
Lizzie's Post-Trial Life
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Kat
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Hello!
I've been thinking about your question and I've gotten out our de Mille ( A Dance of Death ) to look at some things she says were aspects of Lizzie's personality, because I think that whatever Lizzie was before the murders, she probably was those same things after as well.
She is described as surely and stubborn and her offense to her family was to shut them out and not eat with them or speak to them when she was perturbed.
She had a strong sense of what was *fair*- evinced by the girls agitating for similar property after the gift of part of the Fourth Street house to Abby by Andrew.
But to me this is not *fair*. A good Yankee girl at that time should not have questioned her father's authority and judgement in this matter at all.
I tend to think of her as having a feeling of entitlement.
This may make her look worldly and progressive for the times, but basically she was being horribly disrespectful to her father and stepmother.
Lizzie supposedly showed a lot of nerve or courage that Thursday upon the finding of her father's body and also during her ordeal at the trial. This sort of coolness under pressure may have been her true nature and she probably retained this kind of attitude the rest of her life. This may have been a defect in her personality and she may have cultivated it as a trait she envisioned a cultured woman would have.
Hiram Harrington has a decided view of Lizzie before the crimes and Pearson has a lot of anectdotes about Lizzie and later Lizbeth, as do the newspapers.
I've been thinking about your question and I've gotten out our de Mille ( A Dance of Death ) to look at some things she says were aspects of Lizzie's personality, because I think that whatever Lizzie was before the murders, she probably was those same things after as well.
She is described as surely and stubborn and her offense to her family was to shut them out and not eat with them or speak to them when she was perturbed.
She had a strong sense of what was *fair*- evinced by the girls agitating for similar property after the gift of part of the Fourth Street house to Abby by Andrew.
But to me this is not *fair*. A good Yankee girl at that time should not have questioned her father's authority and judgement in this matter at all.
I tend to think of her as having a feeling of entitlement.
This may make her look worldly and progressive for the times, but basically she was being horribly disrespectful to her father and stepmother.
Lizzie supposedly showed a lot of nerve or courage that Thursday upon the finding of her father's body and also during her ordeal at the trial. This sort of coolness under pressure may have been her true nature and she probably retained this kind of attitude the rest of her life. This may have been a defect in her personality and she may have cultivated it as a trait she envisioned a cultured woman would have.
Hiram Harrington has a decided view of Lizzie before the crimes and Pearson has a lot of anectdotes about Lizzie and later Lizbeth, as do the newspapers.
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rajax
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well, I'm thinking of including her on a project I'm working on about infamous women who, instead of feeling victimized, thrived on their notoriety. I thought that maybe she qualified because of her lifestyle after the murders--she bought a huge house in Fall River and apparently ran with a theatrical crowd. Is that true? Was there any part of her that enjoyed her reputation, or did she just want to live quietly?
thanks!
thanks!
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Kat
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That's a good question.
As before, I noted above, that I think she kept her same traits.
Add to that Lizzie's seeming enjoyment of her emancipation- and her decision to not move away to somewhere where she might change her name to Lizbeth and become unknown.
There's some defiance there, that she chose to stay, wouldn't you think?
Emma left and changed her name- and Lizbeth stayed, made friends with an actress and went on jaunts to Boston, Washinton and New York. She bought up property around the French Street house, and she wrote a Brayton to keep his noisy bird quiet.
What else?...
As before, I noted above, that I think she kept her same traits.
Add to that Lizzie's seeming enjoyment of her emancipation- and her decision to not move away to somewhere where she might change her name to Lizbeth and become unknown.
There's some defiance there, that she chose to stay, wouldn't you think?
Emma left and changed her name- and Lizbeth stayed, made friends with an actress and went on jaunts to Boston, Washinton and New York. She bought up property around the French Street house, and she wrote a Brayton to keep his noisy bird quiet.
What else?...
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theebmonique
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Kat
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Rebello, 314:
"Murder Mystery Had Local Twist: Lizzie Borden's Sister Kept Hidden at Newmarket Home," Democrat, Newmarket, NH, February 7, 1981.
Mr. Louis Fillon, 89 years old and a life-long resident of Newmarket, New Hampshire,
remembered that at the age of 18, while delivering grain to 203 South Main Street, he discovered that Emma Borden was living at the two-family home. He was requested by
Emma's lawyer to keep his discovery a secret to prevent Lizzie from finding Emma's
whereabouts and taking her money. He recalled that her companion, Annie Connor, was surprised that he discovered Emma's identity.
Note: Miss Annie Connor was the owner of the home in Newmarket, New Hampshire, where Emma resided. Emma died in Newmarket in 1927. The home was sold five months after Emma's death by Miss Connor in November, 1928."
--You're not a dork. I can't seem to find Emma's name change..but the above reference was supposedly to that very thing.
I'll keep looking.
"Murder Mystery Had Local Twist: Lizzie Borden's Sister Kept Hidden at Newmarket Home," Democrat, Newmarket, NH, February 7, 1981.
Mr. Louis Fillon, 89 years old and a life-long resident of Newmarket, New Hampshire,
remembered that at the age of 18, while delivering grain to 203 South Main Street, he discovered that Emma Borden was living at the two-family home. He was requested by
Emma's lawyer to keep his discovery a secret to prevent Lizzie from finding Emma's
whereabouts and taking her money. He recalled that her companion, Annie Connor, was surprised that he discovered Emma's identity.
Note: Miss Annie Connor was the owner of the home in Newmarket, New Hampshire, where Emma resided. Emma died in Newmarket in 1927. The home was sold five months after Emma's death by Miss Connor in November, 1928."
--You're not a dork. I can't seem to find Emma's name change..but the above reference was supposedly to that very thing.
I'll keep looking.
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Kat
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I'm glad you asked that question, Tracy.
Maybe someone may find it was an author?
I am offtopic here (pardon me) but this is a news item from The Sourcebook, and it seems pretty accurate- so I will include it here. It doesn't say Emma lived under an assumed name.
Maybe someone may find it was an author?
I am offtopic here (pardon me) but this is a news item from The Sourcebook, and it seems pretty accurate- so I will include it here. It doesn't say Emma lived under an assumed name.
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theebmonique
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I don't think that was really off topic. Part of Lizzie's life after the trial included Emma. In Yesterday in Old Fall River: A Lizzie Borden Companion, page 33, it mentions Emma lived under an assumed name , but again, no mention of what it was.
I am sure someone has a book somewhere that would tell us what it was.
Tracy...
I am sure someone has a book somewhere that would tell us what it was.
Tracy...
I'm defying gravity and you can't pull me down.
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william
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From the Archives:Susan wrote:I just checked my stock of Lizzie books, nothing about Emma changing her name. Mostly it was just that she chose to live in anonymity. Sorry, I tried.
"Re Emma's assumed name"
Posted by William on Sep-14-03
(Lizzie Borden Message Board Archives
Posted by TILBA on August 25, 1999)
"Now that I know the whereabouts of the Swansea farm, I'm curious abot Emma's home in Newmarket, NH. Does anyone know the address?
I understand it's a private residence and not open to the public. Has anyone beside Frank Spiering ever been allowed in?"
Last summer Bill and I went to find the old farmhouse and take some pictures. Since it is a private residence we did not attempt to go on the property nor did we want to bother the residents.
However, while we were there a nice lady came out and invited us in for lemonade. We accepted and sat on the porch in Emma's wicker rocker with a descendent of Emma's tabby cat sitting on my lap.
The lady later admitted that the only reason she let us visit is because she had recognized me as the curator of the Lizzie Borden house from a newspaper article. The only other person she let in was indeed Frank Spiering. She did not like Frank and said he had lied in the book There was no secret stairway, no set of light switches and no bars on the windows. ANNIE BORDEN, AS SHE WAS KNOWN WENTG TO CHURCH EVERY SUNDAY.
Note: I believe tht two individuals mentioned in this message wer Bill Pavao and Bill Quigley.
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Harry
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Here's some additional references to Emma's name:
This is from Knowlton, Glossary A:
"Following a falling-out between the two siblings in 1904, she left Maplecroft, the home on French Street in Fall River they had shared for ten years. She relocated first to Providence, Rhode Island, and then to Newmarket, New Hampshire. She made her home in the latter locality, living under an assumed name until her death."
And from Hixon, page 66:
"By this time Emma was living under an assumed name in Newmarket, New Hampshire."
Neither mention the name used.
As for Lizzie, in Williams' Casebook, p254:
"In 1926 Lizzie entered the hospital for a gall bladder operation. She was admitted under the name of Emma Borden of the Hotel Biltmore, Providence, Rhode Island."
I could find this no where else. According to Kent, Lincoln and Rebello, Lizzie used the alias "Mary Smith Borden" for her 1926 stay at the hospital.
This is from Knowlton, Glossary A:
"Following a falling-out between the two siblings in 1904, she left Maplecroft, the home on French Street in Fall River they had shared for ten years. She relocated first to Providence, Rhode Island, and then to Newmarket, New Hampshire. She made her home in the latter locality, living under an assumed name until her death."
And from Hixon, page 66:
"By this time Emma was living under an assumed name in Newmarket, New Hampshire."
Neither mention the name used.
As for Lizzie, in Williams' Casebook, p254:
"In 1926 Lizzie entered the hospital for a gall bladder operation. She was admitted under the name of Emma Borden of the Hotel Biltmore, Providence, Rhode Island."
I could find this no where else. According to Kent, Lincoln and Rebello, Lizzie used the alias "Mary Smith Borden" for her 1926 stay at the hospital.
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theebmonique
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Susan
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Thanks William and Harry. So, Annie Borden lived with Annie Connors and her sister in that house. Interesting how both Lizzie and Emma chose to keep their last name. But, I guess with so many Bordens in the area, it could be overlooked.
Its interesting too that in Spiering he talks about Emma living upstairs with the secret staircase and such, and according to this current home owner, he lied. I also read that Emma used to live in the downstairs front bedroom of the house.
I think it is also Spiering that says that Annie Connor and her sister were poor farmers and Emma dragged them into this deal to obtain the house secretly. Yet, in another, it was that Emma just took a room in Annie Connors boarding house and made it her home for life.
Emma continues to be as mysterious and elusive in death as she was in life!
Its interesting too that in Spiering he talks about Emma living upstairs with the secret staircase and such, and according to this current home owner, he lied. I also read that Emma used to live in the downstairs front bedroom of the house.
I think it is also Spiering that says that Annie Connor and her sister were poor farmers and Emma dragged them into this deal to obtain the house secretly. Yet, in another, it was that Emma just took a room in Annie Connors boarding house and made it her home for life.
Emma continues to be as mysterious and elusive in death as she was in life!
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theebmonique
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FairhavenGuy
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When I first started poking around here last March or so, it was because I was trying to find out what Emma's assumed name was.
See there's another seemingly undocumented assertion that for a short time after Lizzie and Emma had their falling out, Emma lived for a time in Fairhaven.
There is, of course, no Emma Borden listed in our town directories for that time period, so knowing her assumed name might help verify she was here.
One thing I'm working on along these lines is following the many places Helen Brownell lived from the time of the murder until her death. But our directories during those years are listed alphabetically by last name, not by address. Basically, one has to plow through the entire Fairhaven population each year to find out who lived at any particular address.
A conclusion I've come to from reading earlier threads on this subject is that neither Emma nor Lizzie was particularly creative with false names. It's a wonder Emma didn't change her name to Lizzie. . .
See there's another seemingly undocumented assertion that for a short time after Lizzie and Emma had their falling out, Emma lived for a time in Fairhaven.
There is, of course, no Emma Borden listed in our town directories for that time period, so knowing her assumed name might help verify she was here.
One thing I'm working on along these lines is following the many places Helen Brownell lived from the time of the murder until her death. But our directories during those years are listed alphabetically by last name, not by address. Basically, one has to plow through the entire Fairhaven population each year to find out who lived at any particular address.
A conclusion I've come to from reading earlier threads on this subject is that neither Emma nor Lizzie was particularly creative with false names. It's a wonder Emma didn't change her name to Lizzie. . .
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Kat
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Re: Lizzie's Post-Trial Life
Do you have any Pearson?rajax @ Thu Aug 12, 2004 2:51 pm wrote:Hi:
I'm new to the forum and trying to learn a little about Lizzie's post-trial life, and her attitude towards her notoriety. Namely, is there any evidence that she enjoyed the stir she caused (even though she was acquitted and always claimed she was innocent)? I've heard that she bought a huge house and stayed in Fall River, but I was wondering if any could supply any details about whether she felt embarassed by her ordeal, or whether she sort of enjoyed her notoriety....
thanks!
There might be some in the Privy archive.
Do you have William's Casebook?
Personally I think Lizbeth preferred to be a big fish in a little pond, rather than moving to, say, Boston, and becoming a little fish in a big pond.
Surely Nance O'Neil would not have made Lizbeth's acquaintance if she was Miss Shmoe from Ohio?
