The Murder of Abby Borden

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I'm of the opinion that Abby Borden knew her killer. She must have!
How else could an outsider, a stranger have gotten close enough to her
to swing an axe/hatchet at her without her screaming blue bloody murder
(pardon the pun)

This is a older New England women in the upstairs "bedroom" of her own house. At the hight of the Victorian era. "Strangers" would not have been
tolerated in the house without Andrew present, let alone in the upstairs bedroom. I doubt that Abby would have seen even Uncle John's presence as being proper.

She was (as far as we know) beside the bed when struck. This spot is directly inline with the bedroom door, plus the fact the she had a mirror on the bureau. This would have given a pretty good view of any movement around her.

If the killer was family member (or maid), Abby wouldn't have given it much thought as that person(s) entered the room.

To me, this eliminates an outsider/stranger, hired assassin, or madman.

Any thoughts?

[nbcatlover]

I saw part of some horror movie on the Sci-Fi channel. The woman is saying to the person holding an ax above his shoulder ready to strike: "Why are you bringing an ax in the house? What are you going to do with that?" He brings it down on her head.

Didn't catch the name of the movie, didn't watch the end--but I did think of Abby, immediately.

It would make sense to me that she knew her murderer and was not afraid of the person.

[snokkums]

I, too, Ad am a firm believer int he fact that Abby knew her killer. And she ws a very proper Victorian woman . Men dominated the society and she wouldn't have been in upstairs let alone in the bedroom with a stranger, let alone a male stranger.

Either that or someone broke in but tha scenario doesn't fit either, because Lizzie and Bridget were home and they would have seen something, unless they were deaf dumb and blind. And I don't think they were that.

[DWilly]

What also stands out is Abby didn't have any defensive wounds. She didn't try to block any of the blows. Also, nothing appears to have been knocked over in the room. Abby's body isn't that far from the bureau which had a few things on it that could have been knocked over or broken. To me it looks like there was no struggle of any kind in that room. It's as if the killer just walked in and calmly walked over to where Abby was standing. Abby had to have known the killer and trusted them. What's strange is the killer appears to have been so calm and then unleashed such violence on Abby. Only to calm down again once it was over.

Question: Did the murders happen at the height of the Victorian age or near the end of it? When did the Edwardian era begin?

[Allen]

The Victorian era was named for queen Victoria of England. It began in about 1837 and lasted until 1901. The Edwardian era began with the reign of King Edward VII which began in 1901 and ended in about 1910.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwardian

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victorian_era

[Allen]

I agree with all these points. The fact that there were no defensive wounds, there were little signs of a struggle, and the fact that the killer seemed to have been able to approach Abby without causing her any alarm all point to the fact that it wasn't a stranger that killed her.

[Harry]

Mark Twain called the era for America "The Gilded Age". You will find many different year spans but generally it consisted of from about 1870 to about 1917.

[william]

The nature of the crime does not provide is with the evidence that Abby knew her killer. If she were attacked from behind there would be no opportunity to recognize the killer. nor would she have defensive wounds on her hands or arms.

Notwithstanding all of the above - I do think the murderer was someone Abby would have recognized under different circumstances.

[sguthmann]

I tend to agree that Abby and Andrew knew their killer, but I also think neither one had much time to "struggle" once the first blow fell. The attitude in which the bodies were found is more indicative to me that they were going about their business, freshening linens, sitting or reclining on the sofa, and were at ease enough to be doing these things practically up until the second the blows started to rain upon them. That's not to say someone known to them working with someone "unknown" could not have accomplished much the same.

I also think the murderer (and/or accomplice?) - known or unknown by Abby - must have tidied up somewhat. For the life of me, I cannot believe that a 200 lb woman goes down (and hard!) in that small space between a bureau and bed, and NOTHING is out of place on the bureau! All the little delicate "do-hickys" are just perfectly in place. That and the fact that the killer did not leave more of a trail behind him/her.

[Audrey]

It has always secretly amused me when people say that Abby's killer was not someone who caused her alarm... Perhaps not-- but unless they came into the guestroom with the hatchet behind their back she most certainly would have been, at the very least puzzled....

Does anyone think the killer came in with the hatchet secreted behind their back and then just pulled it out real quick and attacked her?

Some have speculated that the person with the axe may have been someone she expected to see using an axe or a hatchet during their daily routine...

I frequently use a leaf blower-- but if I were to suddenly appear in the private areas of my house branshishing it-- I think my family would react quite strongly to this....

At any rate-- even if my beloved husband charged at me from across the room with what was clearly intended to be used as a weapon-- and I saw it-- I would scream bloody murder.

I don't think she saw whoever it was coming....

[Kat]

When she was hit in the face she would know who attacked her. Whether she recognized them is another question.
For all we know she was chased upstairs almost as Bowen thought.

[snokkums]

I agree with you Sguthman. I don't think either one of them had time to struggle once the first blow hit. I also think they knew their killer. But Andrew was sleeping at the time of his murder so there would not be a chance, and Abby had her back turned to the door. The kill had to come thru the door, and it was open.

[Harry]

I've always been torn between the two theories of Abby's position when killed, whether standing looking out the window or kneeling fixing the bed.

I recently ran across this paragraph in the Fall River Evening News, of August 8, 1892, a Monday. Mayor Coughlin gave an interview in which he said in part:

"That she was standing, and erect at that, when she received the first blow seems evident. I think she was looking out of that north window. From her position when found, it seemed that if she had been lifted up from the floor and placed upon her feet, she would have stood just before that window. That should have been done, too; but it was overlooked. I myself did not think of it at the time."

We know for certain that Abby was moved, perhaps even several times, but I don't believe the body was pushed forward or backward so her position in relation to the window is probably unchanged.

In any case it's an interesting point.

[snokkums]

I am thinking that maybe the person was already in the house. Where I am coming from is that it looks like she was hit from behind and quickly because it looks like she was hit in the back of the head and she didn't have time to defend herself. Also she didn't have time to scream. I know for me when I get hit,even when I am not excepting it, I am going to yell. Apparently she didn't do that. If she did Lizzie and Bridget would most certainly have heard her.

[DWilly]

In Radin's book he writes on page 147, that medical examiner Dr. Dolan, "...stated that a flap wound in Mrs. Borden's forehead showed that she had been facing her killer." And on page 149, Radin quotes Dr. Draper as saying this about the flap wound, "I think that that was given while Mrs. Borden was standing and facing her assailant."


Now, last August I went to the Borden house and went up to the guest room. It's not small but it's not a big room either. If someone walked in it would be hard not to notice them. The bed is only a few feet from the door way. The killer would have had to enter through that door and then walk around the bed to get to Abby. I doubt she was wearing an ipod and listening to Bach when the killer came in so I think the killer would have caught her attention. Now, I'm guessing she faced the killer. I don't know my north/south in that room so, to me all I can say is she'd be facing the window facing the street not the window facing Mrs. Churchill's house. The killer suddenly brings up the hatchet and bang, hits Abby. Abby may have spun around or maybe the killer pushed her. Got on top of her and hit the other blows.

[Edisto]

Radin's use of the word "forehead" appears to be in error. At the preliminary hearing, Dr. Dolan testified that "...on the left side, without any mark on the skull, was a flat scalp wound, a wound about one and a half inches wide, and two to three inches long, flapped backwards immediately over the left ear." (Unless Abby was badly deformed, a wound over her left ear wouldn't have been in her forehead!)

Dolan was then asked if there were any wounds on Abby's face. He responded: "On the bridge of the nose there was, what we call a contusion, that is, a black mark, and two over the right eye, and one a little to the left of the left eye." He was asked if there were only contusions there, and responded affirmatively. When asked if they were such (marks) as may have been made by falling, he said that was the case. It sounds as if any wounds on Abby's face (which would include the forehead) weren't made by a sharp implement but were the type of bruises that would result from a fall. ("Contusion" means the skin wasn't broken.)

Dolan also stated during this interrogation that he had found blood in the vicinity of the north window. (This would be the window that faced the Churchill house.) There was a spot of blood on the molding at the top of the "mop board," east of this north window, and about two feet above that spot there was another spot on the wallpaper. According to Dolan, these spots couldn't have spattered from Abby's head wounds if she had been lying in the position in which found, because the dressing case (dresser) would have interrupted their trajectory.

This testimony indicates either that Abby was surprised while standing near the north window or that the killer managed to drip or daub blood on the wallpaper and mop-board molding in that area. If Abby had been standing by the north window, perhaps looking out of it, she wouldn't have been in a position to see her attacker in the mirror.

Think about it -- if you're planning to attack someone with an axe and if you're approaching the person frontally with the axe raised, you probably aren't going to wind up making a flap wound in the person's forehead. It's more likely that you would cut a gash with the leading edge of the axe blade, isn't it? At any rate, if we believe Dr. Dolan, there wasn't any flap wound in Abby's forehead.

[sguthmann]

At the preliminary hearing, Dr. Dolan testified that "...on the left side, without any mark on the skull, was a flat scalp wound, a wound about one and a half inches wide, and two to three inches long, flapped backwards immediately over the left ear." (Unless Abby was badly deformed, a wound over her left ear wouldn't have been in her forehead!)

Actually, from just that quote, Abby could have been facing the killer and have had a flap of skin from the forehead region sliced back and "flapped backwards immediately over the left ear..."

However, we find in Abby's autopsy notes :

1. Was a glancing scalp wound two inches in length by one and 1/2 inches in width, situated 3 inches above left ear hole, cut from above downwards and did not penetrate the skull.

That information, taken with the Dr.'s testimony, says to me that Abby was hit on the left side of the head - not the forehead - and that blow came from above the head, downward, and peeled back scalp above the left ear, which was left hanging, like a "flap" bent backward over the ear.

[Allen]

Trial testimony of Dr. Dolan page 899:

Q. Now then, describe the wounds in detail.
A. Well, taking the left side of the face, there was a scalp wound. That is where the flesh was cut off, but not separated from the head, in other words, making a flap wound, that is, hinge, so that when it fell there it would fall down here. In other words, it was severed from the front backwards.

Q. Is that the approximate shape of the wound?
A. Yes, sir.

Q. That is, merely a slit in the skin?
A. Yes, not touching the skull. That was only two inches in length by one and one-half in width.

I would think that Abby had to be facing her attacker for this blow to have occured no doubt about that. She did not cry out, or make any noise upon seeing the person. The angle of the wound being from above downward could've simply been the axe being raised high in the air and brought downward. I had thought before Abby would've had to be kneeling when it occured but I don't necessarily think that is so anymore. I think if we could reconstruct the wounds somehow, we could figure out what direction Abby was moving in her last few moments of life. That is, which direction her body was moving. I would think the wounds would have to follow and correspond to the movement of her body.

[Susan]

Perhaps it was the killer's plan that Abby look out the window? Obviously if it had been a stranger theres no way. Lizzie (or your favorite suspect) comes up to the guest room and directs Abby to look out the window to the driveway, Bridget is up to something there other than washing the windows like she had been directed. In this way, Abby wouldn't be facing Lizzie when she gave her the first whack and she wouldn't have a chance to see the hatchet and cry out. How did she get the hatchet in the room without alarming Abby though? Could it have actually been something along the lines of Lincoln's idea that Lizzie stuck the hatchet in her stack of laundry that she brought upstairs to her room? Lizzie walking into the room with her own laundry probably wouldn't cause Abby much of a dilemma.


Interesting find, Harry. That would have been something if they attempted to find out about where Abby would have been if standing.

[FairhavenGuy]

Perhaps it was the killer's plan that Abby look out the window?

Which is why Mr. Lubinsky was out in the street yelling, "Hey, Mrs. Borden! You want some more ice cream? I got nice ice cream, here, Mrs. Borden!"

[Allen]

Perhaps it was the killer's plan that Abby look out the window?

Which is why Mr. Lubinsky was out in the street yelling, "Hey, Mrs. Borden! You want some more ice cream? I got nice ice cream, here, Mrs. Borden!"

LOL so that is how Lubinsky was in on it

[Kat]

Perhaps it was the killer's plan that Abby look out the window? Obviously if it had been a stranger theres no way. Lizzie (or your favorite suspect) comes up to the guest room and directs Abby to look out the window to the driveway, Bridget is up to something there other than washing the windows like she had been directed. In this way, Abby wouldn't be facing Lizzie when she gave her the first whack and she wouldn't have a chance to see the hatchet and cry out. How did she get the hatchet in the room without alarming Abby though? Could it have actually been something along the lines of Lincoln's idea that Lizzie stuck the hatchet in her stack of laundry that she brought upstairs to her room? Lizzie walking into the room with her own laundry probably wouldn't cause Abby much of a dilemma.


Interesting find, Harry. That would have been something if they attempted to find out about where Abby would have been if standing.

Then you are saying that the facial flap-wound was not the first wound? If not, how did it happen? Once hit, if from behind, would she have turned toward her attacker, or away?

[Kat]

I don't see any reason why Abby could not have cried out, nor any reason why she had to be kneeling. I think she could have yelled and she could have fallen with a big thud. I just don't rule that out. We don't know that she didn't.

The other thing to remember is, with Edisto's testimonial description of the blood found near the window- sort of around the corner of the bureau- that there was a chair there- a rocking chair. So maybe the chair played a part?

[Allen]

I don't see any reason why Abby could not have cried out, nor any reason why she had to be kneeling. I think she could have yelled and she could have fallen with a big thud. I just don't rule that out. We don't know that she didn't.

The other thing to remember is, with Edisto's testimonial description of the blood found near the window- sort of around the corner of the bureau- that there was a chair there- a rocking chair. So maybe the chair played a part?

The only thing that makes me rule out the idea that Abby cried out when she saw her killer is Bridget. She didn't hear anything. I've always wondered just exactly what Bridget would've been able to hear from where she was stationed. I would think if Abby cried out very loudly she would've heard something. No experiments that have been performed so far have been to my satisfaction in that area.

The idea that Abby probably fell with a thud is a given to me. I think anybody that was downstairs in the house would've heard the noise, yet suspiciously Lizzie says she heard nothing. A body falling down from any position makes a noise, especially if it falls with any degree of force, such as during an attack of some kind. Try and fall soundlessly.

Am I remembering things incorrectly, or wasn't there something called a camp chair in between the bed and the bureau at the time Abby was killed that was removed before the pictures were taken?

[Edisto]

Second Street would have been a very busy place on a weekday morning in 1892. Carriages passing by would probably have made a great deal more racket than today's automobiles with their pneumatic tires. There were probably many loud voices too (though, thankfully, nobody yelling into a cell phone). Abby might well have screamed, and her voice might have been masked by other noise. That could probably have happened with the "thud" she made by falling too. However, a person as heavy as Abby would probably have literally shaken the house if she had fallen from a standing position. I would think anyone who was in the house at the time would at least have said, "What on earth was that?" and gone to investigate. Dr. Dolan described Abby as about 5'3" and estimated that she weighed between 210 and 225 pounds. I'm about that height, but I weigh only about half that much. Abby was one hefty honey!

Some of the testimony with regard to Abby's "flap" wound is confusing at best. If the killer had been facing Abby and had raised the axe (if it was an axe) and brought it down, striking a glancing blow on the side of her head, I would think the resulting wound would be sliced away from the head at its top and "hinged" at the bottom. But I don't think that's what Dr. Dolan described. It sounds as if the slice was toward the front of her head, and the hinge was toward the back. About the only scenario in which that would make sense (to me, anyway) is if Abby were lying on her back, and the axe were brought down from above without enough force to make a clean cut. This flap wound sounds like a missed blow, because it probably wouldn't have done enough damage to put her out of commission. Scalp wounds do bleed copiously, however. Of course there's also that wound in her back, which wasn't immediately discovered. Could it have been the first blow?

[Allen]

Scalp wounds do bleed copiously, however. Of course there's also that wound in her back, which wasn't immediately discovered. Could it have been the first blow?

I have often wondered about that wound on her back as well. What I have wondered is if the flap wound wasn't the first blow, Abby then turned away from her killer at that point trying to flee any way she could out, and then the wound to the back was inflicted. Neither wound was fatal. Both wounds also left time for Abby crying out and trying to defend herself or struggle though.

[Harry]

I like the idea of the wound to the back as the first blow. This could have stunned her enough that she was not able to scream.

Let me put this out there for discussion (or ridicule. ) After the killer had struck the first blow he/she sort of catches her as she's falling and eases her down. This would account for no great noise heard of her falling. It bothers me that the objects on the dresser, with the exception of one, look totally undisturbed. A 200 pound woman or man falling freely would not only make noise but would shake the floor. That picture frame standing on the dresser doesn't exactly look strong enough to stand under much vibration..

Also, could the flap wound have been issued while she was down on the floor? Perhaps she turned around and faced the killer while down when the flap wound was administered and then turned over to avoid any more facial blows.

[FairhavenGuy]

We don't hardly ever ridicule, Harry. . .

I think a little too much is made of the fact that Abby's fall didn't knock the whole room into disarray. The picture frame in particular seems to be one with an ornate frame cast of bronze or iron, such as I've seen in antique stores. Those things are pretty heavy and the one in the Abby photo is leaning back at a pretty stable angle. I really don't think a person falling to the floor would be enough to knock that over. The dresser itself is a very heavy stable piece of furniture and wouldn't shake a whole lot either I expect.

And except in cartoons, folks don't tend to stiffly fall right over and land full force on the floor. Gravity tends to pull one downward, so you'd land more by bending the knees, then landing knees, hips/butt, arms/upper torso, rather than just a freefall BAM!

I don't claim to know which wound Abby got first, and she may have been lowered or moved into her final position, but even if she fell from standing, I don't think there would be enough shaking of the room to knock over all the stuff on the dresser.

[Susan]

[quote="Kat @ Fri Nov 18, 2005 4:22 Then you are saying that the facial flap-wound was not the first wound? If not, how did it happen? Once hit, if from behind, would she have turned toward her attacker, or away?[/quote]

Oh no, I'm not saying that the flap wound couldn't have been the first strike. I'm just thinking it would have been easier to start whacking at Abby if she wasn't facing the killer immediately. Especially if Abby knew her killer. Abby could have turned as the hatchet was falling saying "I don't see what you are talking about...." and slice. I'm just trying to fathom why Abby was at the window, she doesn't seem the type to idly daydream at the window during her morning chores. Was she keeping an eye on Bridget? Was she expecting someone that day?

[Kat]

The only thing that makes me rule out the idea that Abby cried out when she saw her killer is Bridget. She didn't hear anything. ..

The idea that Abby probably fell with a thud is a given to me. I think anybody that was downstairs in the house would've heard the noise, yet suspiciously Lizzie says she heard nothing. ...

Am I remembering things incorrectly, or wasn't there something called a camp chair in between the bed and the bureau at the time Abby was killed that was removed before the pictures were taken?

--Allen

Well, I'm not really saying that Abby cried out when she Saw her killer. I'm more interested in whether she made a racket during her slaughter.
Then, too, I'm not ruling out that Bridget heard something. I can't rule that out.
Also, did anyone Ask Lizzie if she heard anything? I don't recall that Lizzie ever claimed she "heard nothing."

The camp chair was at the head of the bed, at the east wall. The rocker was in position between the bureau and the window.

I asked if anyone thought the rocker came into play in this crime.
What if Abby was sitting there hand sewing?
Hit from above, face to face, the wound to her ear area as a missed blow = the flap wound. Forensic investigators say the first blow is *free.*
Then she fell forward to her knees on the floor and tried to crawl away between the bed and bureau. That's when she got the upper back wound, as second blow. That stopped her finally and the head blows ensued.

I've also had a picture in my mind of so much time passing after Abby's murder - a person humming and putting any fallen items back into place on the dresser, removing the sewing and putting it away...humming...setting the room to rights...

I'm just speculating that anything we think should be disturbed yet isn't, was not necessarily Not disturbed- but put back in place. Why- I don't know.
That's why I see the humming. It is a person who is negating what they have just done, stepping over Abby's dead body straightening things, as if she didn't exist...

[Harry]

The importance of the noise of Abby's fall is critical to Lizzie's alibi, what little there was of one. When we were there in August, Ben, our tour guide fell to the floor and believe me you heard it. I wasn't down in the kitchen at the time, as Lizzie claimed she was, but you would have had to be hard of hearing not to have heard it. And Ben is not 200 pounds.

I'm surprised that the police did not try a similar experiment. But then again the police didn't try a lot of things.

Chris, as for the picture frame you have a point. It may be heavy and since we can't see behind it we don't know the strength of the support that held it up.

There is one object that we have never been able to determine what it was that does look like it's out of place.



We've had discussions of the objects on the dresser and walls but this particular object remains mysterious.

[DWilly]

I was thinking last night that perhaps the killer walked in, Abby saw the killer and knew who it was and was not alarmed by their presence. The killer had the hatchet hidden is some way. Abby just for a second turned her back to the killer and that's when they struck. Hitting her in the back was sort of a miss hit by an inexperienced murderer. Abby then turned around and faced the killer and that's when she got hit in the front. making the flap wound. She then fell over and the killer got on top of her and did the other blows. I was thinking that maybe the killer wanted to first hit Abby from behind thus avoiding a fight of any kind. Or a scream. After all, the killer waited until Andrew was nicely taking a nap on the couch. Thus, avoiding a fight with him.

[FairhavenGuy]

Harry, we have, of course, another front view of the "object" in the other Abby photo that shows the camera reflected in the mirror.

Looking at poor quality online versions, my guess is that that, too, is a picture frame, that's sort of shield shaped. The front view of the dresser shows that there was a pretty symetrical arrangement. It would make sense that a picture frame on the right side might be mirrored by another picture frame on the left side.

I'm guessing that a quick glance at the good quality print of the original photo would quickly tell us what the object is.

[sheryl]

Hello. Long time lurker, first time poster here. Just wanted to ask about the other picture on the dresser. This image makes it clearer than I've seen in any books. It appears to be the form of two females. Could it be a photograph of Emma and Lizzie at much younger ages? Could it be Sarah and Emma? Would the girls keep a picture of their mother on that dresser just to annoy Abby? I would sure love to know who that picture is of, maybe its not even family but friends?

With all this posting about exactly where and how Abby was positioned when first struck, I think she was on her knees tucking in the bedspread, didn't see Lizzie approach until just upon. No thud noise. Bridget talking to Mary the next door maid diagonnaly opposite outside over the fence wouldn't hear anyting. The guest room windows were all shut werent they?

Back to the other photograph. Does anybody have any information as to who those "people" might be?

Thank you.

[Gramma]

That does look to be another picture and is that the stand it should be in in front of it? Some picture frames had stands to hold them upright.

Gramma

[Harry]

I have no idea of what it is but it does not look like a picture frame to me. The shape is too irregular.

What is in front of the object is a mirror lying flat on a doily.

[FairhavenGuy]

If you look at the straight-on view, the object appears to be symetrical and shield shaped, like a big, narrow police badge. I think it could very well be a picture frame. The edge shot that Harry posted shows it's relatively thin and has a shiny metalic finish on its edge.

[sguthmann]

I tend to think the shield-shaped item is a metal picture frame. I'll try to find an example and post a picture of it, if possible.

And I still don't but that Abby could fall to the floor in that small area without anything on the bureau being shaken and askew. Only explanation I can come up for the items being as they should be and not having been tampered with is if Abby was kneeling when th attack began...and I'm not so sure I can believe that because of the placement of the initial wounds.

So, I'm left to think it is HIGHLY likely that some tidying up occurred after Abby's murder - and not just because of the figurines on the dresser, but the nearly immaculate state of the room in general. But that leads me to wonder, why would someone waste time putting little do-dads back into place? Cleaning up blood evidence is one thing, but setting frames and figurines right again is quite another. It doesn't make much practical sense to me. Anyone else?

[Audrey]

[Audrey]

It looks like what might be a shallow candy dish or salver of some kind.

[Allen]

I'm thinking more along the lines of it's the knob to the drawer it's sitting in front of.

[Allen]

Here is an example of what I'm talking about. If you notice, the shape behind the picture resembles the other knobs on the dresser.

This was a customary the style of furniture made in that period. That seems to be what it is resting against. But it looks like it might be some kind of engraving?

http://www.maine.gov/museum/collections ... erBed.html

http://www.prices4antiques.com/itemsummary/175847.htm

[Audrey]

I don't think we are talking about the knob were we?

[Allen]

No the object in front of it, that is resting on the knob, I said it could be some kind of engraving. Such as this only larger.



http://www.victorian-gifts.com/store/ca ... i3598.html

[Allen]

Ok maybe I called it the wrong thing. I knew what I was thinking of in my mind..but they are called cameo's.

http://www.antiquesjournal.com/Pages04/ ... ameos.html

[sguthmann]

sorry, but i think we can rule out a cameo. cameos were almost always jewelry pieces. this object is far too large. it still seems to me that it's a metal frame.

[Allen]

Yes alot of cameo jewelry was made, but I've also seen wall hangings and small pictures that were made in much the same way. This is what gave me the idea it could be a cameo type image.

[Haulover]

i think she must have been on her knees before she was on her face because there were strikes on top of her head. i think she had to face the killer first because of the location of the "flap wound." i agree with fairhaven about falling in "stages" as opposed to all 200 lbs at once.

there's always this other ambiguity about the flap wound though: the axe has to be aimed at her face to do it, yes, but from the description (as posted earlier in this thread) that direction is also "somewhat downward" -- meaning from that in itself alone, it is possible that abby received it while on her knees and looking up at the killer. then again, the killer can be considerably taller.

where the back wound fits in the sequence is challenging, though. i've considered that as first. which fits in with the idea of abby staring out the window when it happens. and i've thought about why abby is staring out the window, and i've imagined that she has gone there in dismay about something.

it would seem that the first strike had to be the front flap wound. but then you wonder why the back wound, when the focus of the work is squarely on the head. this could be simply because that upper back area is closer to the axe when she falls over on her face -- after she is struck on top of the head while on her knees.

i keep in mind some observations made to me by people who look at the photo who don't know much about the case -- and i've heard more than once that abby's hips appear to be slightly raised, as if she fell over from her knees. but then, this is the point where we get into the bodies being tampered with afterwards. it does look like abby's skirt might have been pulled down; but there is evidence against her body being moved to a great extent. i remember vividly the print at the FRHS -- the glue-like consistency of the blood, it looks basically plastered there.

morse said he saw blood on her face -- this would indicate after doherty and someone else turned her over. the question here is -- exactly how was she turned over or lifted? wasn't she more or less rolled over and then "back into place?" now that i think about it, she couldn't have been vertically lifted.

[Kat]

Placement of the chairs.
They take up the extra room.
In one picture I have the rocker facing one way, and in another view I have it facing a different direction.

Lizzie, when asked what she thought Abby could have been doing all that time that Lizzie did not see Abby, she said Abby might have been sewing.
She also remarked that she herself was supposed to be helping make pillow cases. The recent video showed Abby measuring the pillows with a yard stick. That's what made me think Abby was possibly sewing after all.
Of course, a sewer would more likely measure an object with a flexible tape, but would measure fabric with a yard stick. One of the things in the room remarked upon was a yardstick.
Lizzie says she herself had done a little sewing in her room. So I ask where do they keep the sewing things? Are all the things kept in the guest room? There might have been some casual sewing going on, with Lizzie helping Abby, or not. But they would be seated.
The seated position during an attack made sense to me after reading what Edisto's point of view was.

Inquest
Lizzie
63
Q. Can you give me any suggestion as to what occupied her when she was up there, when she was struck dead?
A. I don't know of anything except she had some cotton cloth pillow cases up there, and she said she was going to commence to work on them. That is all I know. And the sewing machine was up there.
.......
79
Q. Do you know of any employment that would occupy your mother for the two hours between nine and eleven in the front room?
A. Not unless she was sewing.
Q. If she had been sewing you would have heard the machine?
A. She did not always use the machine.
Q. Did you see, or were there found, anything to indicate that she was sewing up there?
A. I don't know. She had given me a few weeks before some pillow cases to make.
Q. My question is not that. Did you see, or were there found, anything to indicate that she had done any sewing in that room that morning?
A. I don't know. I was not allowed in that room; I did not see it.
Q. Was that the room where she usually sewed?
A. No sir.
Q. Did you ever know her to use that room for sewing?
A. Yes sir.
Q. When?
A. Whenever she wanted to use the machine.
Q. When she did not want to use the machine, did you know she used that room for sewing?
A. Not unless she went up to sew a button on, or something.
_____________

If Abby was doing some hand sewing, she would sit near the window for light. Then we would have someone tidying up the room after the murder, for sure.

[DWilly]

Wow, I've tried to picture in my mind what the room looked like with the chairs but this really gives a much clearer idea. Makes that space look even smaller.