Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 7:45 pm
There were enough people that described Lizzie's eyes to make you think that they were as they appear in her photos. As for Lizzie's eyes not matching, that could explain her bad aim.
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eye color
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 8:35 am
Thanks Fargo, you gave me a good laugh to start the day.
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 3:21 am
Well, it would be interesting to know if Lizzie always had needed glasses but either no one knew or maybe she was too proud of her appearance to wear them. Then, if we figure astigmatism, maybe she had a learning disability? That might cause her to quit school and quit piano.
If she had pride, she would drop those pursuits at which she could not excell, based on her poor eyesight.
Maybe she mistook Abby for Uncle John?
That would have been an interesting murder, too, wouldn't it?
If she had pride, she would drop those pursuits at which she could not excell, based on her poor eyesight.
Maybe she mistook Abby for Uncle John?
That would have been an interesting murder, too, wouldn't it?
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 3:25 am
Strange you should mention that! I have always thought about her having a learning disability. I never read anything about it, but for some reason it was always in the back of my mind.
Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2005 7:18 pm
Has this theory come up before?
(Not that Lizzie mistook Abby for Morse)- but that Lizzie may have had bad eyesight?
It might influence a choice of weapon, whoever *did it*.
(Not that Lizzie mistook Abby for Morse)- but that Lizzie may have had bad eyesight?
It might influence a choice of weapon, whoever *did it*.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:04 pm
I have astigmatism myself, diagnosed by my grade school eye doctor whcih I imagine Lizzie wouldn't have had around in her day. My eyesight has never been bad, I can see fine, my glasses are supposed to be for reading and close work, though I've never worn them much. My thought is that if Lizzie's eyesight was that bad, could she have had glasses earlier on in life? We have the one photo of her in the pince-nez which seems like such an affectation, but, she wore them in a photograph. Almost as if she is proud of them, maybe a new acquisition, maybe at an age where she didn't care about vanity as much? Its an interesting question. Could she have seen well enough also to determine if there were bloodstains on and about herself? No one saw anything amiss on her after the murders. 
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 11:45 pm
Was this the Lizbeth who was friends with Nance?
Pearson only states that this is Lizzie "probably taken after the trial."
Yes she may very well have been proud of her *new* glasses and so wore them in her portrait.
I didn't think of her having problems seeing blood spots, etc.
Good question.
When I was young I never knew that others saw as badly as I, until I got my first glasses!
But also, because my vision was so bad, I was afraid of the dark- petrified in fact- because I wasn't ever sure what I was seing.
Pearson only states that this is Lizzie "probably taken after the trial."
Yes she may very well have been proud of her *new* glasses and so wore them in her portrait.
I didn't think of her having problems seeing blood spots, etc.
Good question.
When I was young I never knew that others saw as badly as I, until I got my first glasses!
But also, because my vision was so bad, I was afraid of the dark- petrified in fact- because I wasn't ever sure what I was seing.
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 3:49 am
I think this might have been the Lizzie that Nance knew, Lizzie doesn't appear to be that old in this photo and that hairstyle looks very 1890s still. Edisto may know better than I, but, that high collar on her outfit looks late 1800s, early 1900s. Honestly, every time I've glanced at this photo in its smaller size, I always would think its Lizzie in her 60s.
Lizzie's glasses don't appear to magnify her eyes too much, the prescription doesn't look to be very strong. Makes me wonder, did Andrew or Abby have specs too?
Lizzie's glasses don't appear to magnify her eyes too much, the prescription doesn't look to be very strong. Makes me wonder, did Andrew or Abby have specs too?
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:21 am
I don't like saying things when I can't find my source, but I recall at least one book saying that the picture was taken in 1904 or about 1904.
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 12:02 pm
I think I've also read that this image is of Lizzie in the early 20th Century. That would make her about 45 or so? She doesn't look particularly aged, but she is definitely plumper than in her pretrial photos (assuming they really are pictures of Lizzie and that they were taken before the murders). I'm sorry that I can't see enough of her outfit to peg the style to a particular period. The high collar might point to a date around 1900, but we don't know whether Lizzie tried to keep up with the styles as she aged. Less structured, more comfortable clothing for women began coming in around the second decade of the 1900s, so it may well be before that. If Lizzie wore the pince-nez as reading glasses, that may have meant she had developed presbyopia, which most people get in their forties.
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:36 pm
Thanks for your input, Edisto. 
Re: eye color
Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:07 pm
By the looks of her photos, her eyes were very emotionless but bright. She didn't show much character in her eyes, and that's what makes them so spooky.
But since her eyes look so light in the photos i would assume she had very light gray eyes, not even blue, but mostly light gray, and i love gray eyes.
But since her eyes look so light in the photos i would assume she had very light gray eyes, not even blue, but mostly light gray, and i love gray eyes.
Re: eye color
Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:56 am
Well, Amber, you are correct in your assumption of her eye color. According to Lizzie's Passport from her 1890 Grand Tour, her eye color was gray.
Here is a copy of her passport (Click on image to enlarge):
Here is a copy of her passport (Click on image to enlarge):
Re: eye color
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 9:42 am
Interesting! It's fun to see that Lizzie was 5'3" - Elizabeth Montgomery was 5'7" - EM's dress that she wore in her film about Lizzie is in the Lizzie Borden house - it seemed so small, but Lizzie was 4" shorter!
Re: eye color
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:54 pm
Yes, I agree. It is fun to see the applicant descriptions for the features of our Lizzie. I knew that the dress Elizabeth Montgomery wore in The Legend of Lizzie Borden film, is displayed at the B&B on Second Street. However, I find it intriguing that the dress is so small. I did a Google search and found a picture of the dress. The image below not only shows the dress, but a door with the door knob showing. The dress appears to be unrealistically small when compared to the height of the door knob that is displayed next to it. I assume the height of the door knob in the following image, is the same as the height of a door knob that is on any regular size door. I am really curious to know if the picture below shows an accurate comparison.
Click on image to enlarge:
During a Google search, I found several web sites which state that Elizabeth Montgomery was 5’ 8” - 5’ 8½” and weighted 127 lbs. If it is true that her height was 5' 8", and she weighted 127lbs, then she was tall and very thin.
Sources: http://tinyurl.com/ybkdc3xx http://tinyurl.com/ybbhfr37 http://tinyurl.com/y7fq6kc5
Click on image to enlarge:
During a Google search, I found several web sites which state that Elizabeth Montgomery was 5’ 8” - 5’ 8½” and weighted 127 lbs. If it is true that her height was 5' 8", and she weighted 127lbs, then she was tall and very thin.
Sources: http://tinyurl.com/ybkdc3xx http://tinyurl.com/ybbhfr37 http://tinyurl.com/y7fq6kc5
Re: eye color
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:55 pm
I am sure you are aware of the fact that Lizzie Borden and Elizabeth Montgomery are sixth cousins once removed both women are descends from Samuel Luther. I did a Google search and found the following two web sites, which show the descendants of Lizzie and Elizabeth. I am most familiar with the descendants listed in the first web site:
http://tinyurl.com/ycejlxaf
http://tinyurl.com/yd62zzld
I also found it quiet interesting that Lizzie was related to so many famous people: http://tinyurl.com/y7d8hm9f
Elizabeth also had a number of famous relatives: http://tinyurl.com/y9wc54m7
BYW, there is a thread here on the forum titled, Smaller People in the 1800s?, which you may find quite interesting. Here is the link: http://tinyurl.com/y7on86ym
http://tinyurl.com/ycejlxaf
http://tinyurl.com/yd62zzld
I also found it quiet interesting that Lizzie was related to so many famous people: http://tinyurl.com/y7d8hm9f
Elizabeth also had a number of famous relatives: http://tinyurl.com/y9wc54m7
BYW, there is a thread here on the forum titled, Smaller People in the 1800s?, which you may find quite interesting. Here is the link: http://tinyurl.com/y7on86ym
Re: eye color
Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:31 pm
Her eyes always looked light to me and I read comments about her eyes. She apparently had a spooky way of looking at people. I have heard she had red hair but according to her passport, it was brown.amber_g27 wrote: Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:07 pm By the looks of her photos, her eyes were very emotionless but bright. She didn't show much character in her eyes, and that's what makes them so spooky.
But since her eyes look so light in the photos i would assume she had very light gray eyes, not even blue, but mostly light gray, and i love gray eyes.
Re: eye color
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:49 pm
I have to believe that the information recorded on Lizzie passport is, without a doubt, correct. William L. Benedict, the man who signed the application, certified that he knew Lizzie personally, and that the facts stated in her affidavit are true. I don't think we can debunk the information that came directly from someone who personally knew her.
Re: eye color
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 5:02 pm
Yep, a totally different body type than Lizzie's. Lizzie according to her passport was 5'3" and curvytwinsrwe wrote: Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:54 pm Yes, I agree. It is fun to see the applicant descriptions for the features of our Lizzie. I knew that the dress Elizabeth Montgomery wore in The Legend of Lizzie Borden film, is displayed at the B&B on Second Street. However, I find it intriguing that the dress is so small. I did a Google search and found a picture of the dress. The image below not only shows the dress, but a door with the door knob showing. The dress appears to be unrealistically small when compared to the height of the door knob that is displayed next to it. I assume the height of the door knob in the following image, is the same as the height of a door knob that is on any regular size door. I am really curious to know if the picture below shows an accurate comparison.
Click on image to enlarge:
a2b3dd2fa4ac75570408e3d2b46eb0b5.jpg
During a Google search, I found several web sites which state that Elizabeth Montgomery was 5’ 8” - 5’ 8½” and weighted 127 lbs. If it is true that her height was 5' 8", and she weighted 127lbs, then she was tall and very thin.
Sources: http://tinyurl.com/ybkdc3xx http://tinyurl.com/ybbhfr37 http://tinyurl.com/y7fq6kc5
Re: eye color
Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:37 pm
Lizzie Borden and Elizabeth Montgomery may have had different body types, but I still think Elizabeth portrayed the part of Lizzie very accurately for a Victorian woman.
Re: eye color
Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:09 pm
I totally agree!twinsrwe wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:37 pm Lizzie Borden and Elizabeth Montgomery may have had different body types, but I still think Elizabeth portrayed the part of Lizzie very accurately for a Victorian woman.