Lizzie Borden Society Forum

I wrote this, beginning at 2:00 this morning, when I awoke from a disturbing nightmare about Lizzie. According to my sleep-deprived brain, I guess this is my official “Who-Done-It” theory.

–EVERY FAMILY HAS SECRETS--

Lizzie and Emma hired someone to kill their stepmother because there has been huge amounts of tension and hatred in the house, due to Emma & Lizzie’s uneasiness about money and the will. They know their father is getting older. They know someday they will have to face his demise. Perhaps, since Andrew was 70 and knew it had to be done sooner than later, he mentioned that he will be making his will soon. This causes major problems in the household. It is a civil war. Money makes people say and do crazy things. Perhaps, if Andrew was an especially evil man, he threatened the girls with his will. Perhaps the ominous will was like another member of the family that Andrew used to his advantage. Perhaps he used it to make the girl toe the line. Perhaps he used it to make them wish he was a father who wouldn’t do such things...

The girls have never been on good terms with Abby. They resent her and make her life hell, and in turn Abby resents them and knows the one way she has the upper hand: Andrew. She plays that card a lot. It is a HUGE competition between the girls and Abby. Sometimes Abby wins...sometimes the girls win. Sometimes neither of them win and then they all hate Andrew for not choosing a side. The poor guy is getting yanked in every imaginable way possible. It is a never ending battle and it is getting tiresome and annoying. Abby was very proud of herself when she won the battle about the house for her sister. The girls did not swallow their defeat. They retaliated and Andrew gave in by giving them money for another house. WAR IS HELL. It was a truce for a while, but not for long. Each woman watched their back, knowing that you cannot trust the enemy even if a white flag is waived in the air.

They don’t call Abby mother. They’re civil to their father because they have to be. He provides for them. He is their source for food, shelter, & clothing...and in their minds not much else. The family doesn’t eat together. They don’t “hang out” together. The tension in the air of that house could be sliced with a knife. It’s been on a downward spiral for years and keeps getting worse and worse with no relief in sight...

The girls resent their father for not always siding with them. For not always getting the things they want. They resent him because he is in control of a lot of money, and they don’t see eye to eye with him on ways to spend it, or in Andrew’s case, ways of NOT spending it. They blame him for bringing Abby into the household, and in their minds, bringing a lot of misery to their lives. Perhaps, for reasons that I will never know, there were circumstances in that household which prevented Emma & Lizzie from ever having real friends. From ever having the chance to marry and have families. Perhaps, in their minds, their lives were wasted on a “miserly old fart and a fat, old witch.” They are sick and tired of their dull lives; of being envious of others when they know they can have just as much or more. They believe that their lives can still be redeemed. That maybe, just maybe, if they had their father’s money, they could have friends, they could still find husbands and have children. They dream. They wish. They hope. But every morning, they wake up in the same drab house, doing nothing all day long, having no prospects, and living in a house with two people they’ve grown to despise.

But as long as Andrew & Abby are alive, nothing will ever change. Emma & Lizzie believe they are entitled to things that they want mainly because in their minds they believe they have “put up with a lot over the years.” If Andrew does die soon, and if Abby get a majority of the money, then in Emma & Lizzie’s minds, the enemy will have won. They’ll be damned if it happens...Their lives will be just as bad or worse if that happens. THAT CAN NOT HAPPEN. Lots of late-night talks in their sitting room. The two sisters share lots of whispers in the night. Secrets that Andrew, Abby, and Bridget can’t hear...

–THE PLAN OF THE CENTURY--

Finally, something had to be done. They were losing the battle. Abby was winning. They knew it and she knew it. Andrew was going to have a new will made out soon. The daughters had pissed him off to the point where he could care less about what happened to them after he died. They were ungrateful in his opinion, and they would settle for what little he gave them. He warned them. They shut up. But still, the whispers in the night continued...

The drawing of the will loomed closer. Their far-fetched plan began to grow and breathe. It became a living thing. They nurtured it. It grew stronger and stronger everyday. Then, on one not so very special day, it become a reality...with the help of one Uncle John Morse.

This is my strong belief: Emma & Lizzie couldn’t kill. But, they could definitely hire it to be done. They do, after all, have money. Money their father gave them for a house; plus allowance money they’ve been saving for years. But, they can’t hire anyone in Fall River. They don’t have connections. They don’t know who to ask. They don’t know the places to look. But, Emma especially, knows someone who could help. Someone she corresponds with more than she admitted to in court. Someone who she relays the household problems to. Someone who has known for years the turmoil that goes on in the house on 92nd street. Someone, who for years, has heard a one-sided sob story from a woman named Emma Lenora Borden. Someone who would more than likely have to support the girls if they didn’t get their “rightful” inheritance from their father. And because of that information, and because they were his late-sister’s daughters, that someone, John Morse, was willing to assist in their far-fetched plan. John Morse knew all kinds of people from all walks of life. He had been around. John Morse said, “Yes. I will help you.”

Lizzie was brave enough to be at the house when it happened. Emma was not. She left town. Thank goodness for her gutsy sister Lizzie. Emma, who was like a mother to Lizzie, felt protected by her little sister. Her little sister had nerves of steel. Emma had never known anyone like Lizzie in her entire life. Lizzie would take care of everything. Emma wouldn’t have to worry about a thing. She helped plan the deed, and Lizzie would help finish it.

They didn’t have time to spare. Andrew would be going to a lawyer soon. Uncle Morse needed time to find the right person to get the job done. “Give me a few days, and I will give you your future,” wrote Uncle Morse in a letter.

“How? How do we delay it?” asked Emma in a letter that was quickly burned after being read.

Uncle John replied to his niece Emma in a letter, which was quickly burned, that prussic acid would be a good tool to make Andrew & Abby sick. Sick enough so they can’t leave the house for a few days. Sick enough so a trip to the lawyer wouldn’t be possible. Sick enough to make a very important piece of paper, the will, wait.

It was a great idea, all in all. But Lizzie would soon find out it was easier said than done...

–ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS--

Emma wouldn’t be sick, because she wouldn’t be there. Lizzie wouldn’t be sick, but she would pretend to be. Part of the plan was to subtly inform some neighbors and friends that Andrew possibly had an enemy. Lizzie was good at lying to your face. She could say those words without blinking an eye, and make someone believe it. She told Alice Russell that father had an enemy; perhaps someone who would even go so far as to poison the household.

Lizzie is good at acting. You might say she had a passion for it. She could play sick just as easily as she would later play innocent in court. She was a natural...

The plan was becoming a reality. The date was set. Steps of “pre-murder” were taking shape. Andrew, Abby, and yes even poor Bridget, were throwing up. They were violently ill. Lizzie sat up in her room and smiled. Emma sat in a house far away and hoped that Lizzie wouldn’t let her down.

The drawing of the will was delayed. Uncle John and a mysterious “friend” were on their way to Fall River. Things can get accomplished pretty quickly when you put your mind to it...and when you have enough money to keep someone quiet for the rest of their lives.

The day was drawing near. Uncle Morse arrived. The mysterious “friend” stayed the night in a motel, but not before being shown the Borden residence right before John made his unannounced visit; not before going over the plan; a plan they had gone over a hundred times in the days before...

Lizzie was at a friend’s house, indicating her father had an enemy. By the time she came home, she knew Uncle Morse was to be there. He better be anyway.

He was there. She climbed the stairs and didn’t acknowledge him. Best not to say a word. The maid might say “They talked to each other. They looked like they were planning something.” It would be best to avoid contact with each other at all costs.

“So sorry to hear you’re feeling ill,” Morse would say in a bellowing voice as he sat in the parlor with Andrew & Abby as they chatted.

Lizzie heard these words upstairs in her bedroom. She breathed a huge sigh of relief. Tomorrow would be the first day of the rest of her life.

–LIZZIE: CENTER STAGE--

The next morning Andrew is feeling better than Abby is. Well enough to go out about town. Lizzie knew this would be the case. If Andrew Borden is able to see to his business, he will. Sick or not. He goes out that morning. According to plan...

John Morse eats breakfast with the Bordens. Lizzie is avoiding him as planned. John leaves. He meets his “mysterious friend” at the time and place they agreed upon.

Lizzie gets ready and comes downstairs. She mentions to Bridget that there is a sale at a store. She offers to give her money to go to it. Bridget doesn’t seem particularly interested. Now the back-up plan will have to suffice. Bridget runs outside to vomit. While Bridget is out of the room, Lizzie mentions to Abby that the front windows need cleaned and to make sure that Bridget cleans them. Especially now since Uncle John is here. It’s atrocious to have dirty windows when a guest is in the home. Abby agrees. Bridget returns to the room. Abby orders Bridget to clean the windows. Plan still going good, even if the back-up option had to be applied.

Bridget is leaving the house and going outside to prepare for her window washing.

Lizzie went upstairs to get a very important envelope. She returned back downstairs to find Abby dusting the dining room. Being especially nice for some reason, Lizzie tells Abby to go back upstairs and rest. She will tidy up the house and clean the guest bedroom. Abby, surprised by this unusual act of kindness, agrees. She is not feeling well. It will be nice to rest. She ascends the stairs.

John Morse and mysterious friend are watching and waiting nearby. They watch as Bridget is getting things ready to wash windows. They wait for Lizzie to go to the back door and give the signal. Lizzie hollers at Bridget to make sure she is washing the windows. Bridget says “yes.”

All is clear. John Morse tells mysterious friend to go to the back door where Lizzie will be waiting in the kitchen. John sees that he enters the house. All is going according to plan. He leaves, right on time to match his planned itinerary for the day.

Lizzie and Uncle John’s mysterious friend must act quick. The mysterious friend shows Lizzie the note he wrote. The note states that a friend is sick and would Abby please tend to her immediately. He needs to leave immediately before Bridget or Abby see him. Lizzie wants to confirm that everything is going to happen according to plan; that Abby will leave the house immediately to see her sick friend. That she will be attacked on her way there.

He says to Lizzie, “I’ll be waiting. When she walks by I will grab her and kill her. I will make it look like a robbery gone wrong.”

Lizzie says “good” as she reaches for her envelope, which is full of money.

–A SIMPLE PLAN GONE WRONG--

BUT WAIT! They hear Abby coming down the stairs. Lizzie tells him to shoo! Instead of escaping out the back door where he entered, he makes an exit through the sitting room, and is going to run out the front door. He intended on leaving and not coming back. The plan was over and done with as far as he was concerned. BUT THERE’S BRIDGET OUTSIDE THE WINDOW! “Jesus Christ,” he says to himself as he runs up the front stairs. He dodges into Lizzie's bedroom. He looks down at his hand. He still has the note. Lizzie still has the money. He doesn't think Bridget saw him. The plan is still on...

Abby comes down the stairs and notices that Lizzie is acting strange. “What’s wrong? Are you not feeling well?” Lizzie nods. Abby continues, “Well, I can’t seem to rest. I think I’ll tidy up down here and freshen up the guest room.”

Lizzie wonders where the nameless man is hiding. This is not good. She must find him. She watches as Abby leaves through the sitting room, through the entry way, and toward the front stair case. She follows her. She takes a quick look to see if Bridget is still washing windows. She is.

Upstairs, Lizzie quickly glances around to find the would-be killer. She stands in the landing area. She doesn’t see him. Her heart is beating wildly in her chest. She is shaking. Without thinking she hollers “WHERE ARE YOU?”

Abby, who is in the guest bedroom says, “Hush, Lizzie, I’m right here.”

Lizzie looks around for the man once more before she enters the guest bedroom. “Uh, I’ll help youl," Lizzie proclaims to her step-mother.

Abby stands there with a blank look on her face, looking past Lizzie’s shoulders. “Who are you,” Abby asks the strange man wearing one of Lizzie’s dresses.

Lizzie turns around and steps out of the way as the man enters the room. He is holding a small hatchet in his hand. He approaches Abby. Confused, she looks at Lizzie, looks back at the strange man wearing a red dress, and again asks in a voice burdened with bewilderment, “Who are you?

He keeps walking toward her. He raises the hatchet to strike her. She turns to run, but not before he grabs her by the shoulders, spins her around and hits her in the face with the butt end of his hatchet. He grabs a hold of her braid. It rips off in his hands. He pushes Abby to the floor and begins to frantically hit her in the back of her head. The hatchet is small. It feels awkward in his hands. He doesn’t know how hard to hit. He hits until he’s sure he caused enough damage to end her life. “A larger one would have been more sufficient,” he would later think to himself after it was all said and done.

Lizzie stood in the doorway of the guest bedroom watching her step-mother get hacked to death. Each whack surprisingly sounded quite reassuring. Each whack sounded final. She liked that. She at first covered her mouth with her hand, aghast, but she slowly lowered her hands to her sides and watched with amusing interest, her mouth slightly agape, still in disbelief that her eyes were witnessing such an event. Just as quick as it begun, it was over with.

Lizzie reaches for her envelope. “Here’s your money,” she screamed as she held it out for him.

He lifted his finger to his lips and whispered, “Shh.”

He stood there looking at Lizzie. She seemed very satisfied with herself. She realized she was grasping the envelope of money tightly in her hands. She relaxed her grasp and held out the envelope to him in such a way that if he took it, the woman laying on the floor would be even more dead once the exchange took place.

“This is not according to plan,” he reminded Lizzie. Her eyes turned dark. She glared at him. He was right. This was not according to plan at all.

“Why are you wearing my dress,” Lizzie asked as she lowered the envelope away from his reach...

Abby was supposed to be murdered on her way to visit a sick friend. It was supposed to be outdoors, near a wooded area. Not inside their home. She was supposed to be missing. She was supposed to be rotten and decayed by the time she was found. Instead, there she lay upon the floral carpet in the guest bedroom in a puddle of blood and in a strange position that caught Lizzie off-guard. The position of Abby made Lizzie giggle softly to herself.

Lizzie ran downstairs to check if Bridget was still busy washing windows. She was. Lizzie ran back upstairs and told the man that they both must drag the body out of the house. The mysterious man looked at Lizzie like she was a lunatic. Lizzie said “We must hide her in the spot where she was originally going to get killed.”

“That isn’t going to happen, lady” he told her plainly.

Lizzie began to get nervous. She knew that Bridget would be getting done with her work soon. She knew that her father would be coming home soon. How would she explain a dead step-mother?

Lizzie blurted out, “Father will have to be killed too. He will know that Emma & I planned this. He will report this to the police. He won’t care why. YOU HAVE TO KILL HIM TOO.”

The man told Lizzie that it will cost more money. She didn’t miss a beat; she gritted her teeth and told him “I don’t care.”

The man asked when do you expect your father home. “What is the time,” she asked the man. 10 o’clock he said as he looked at his clock.

“Soon. Very soon,” was her reply.

“I want you to hide in the barn. I will try to get Bridget out of the house. You will come in and kill father.”

Carefully, Lizzie and the man went down the staircase. Lizzie checked to see if Bridget was busy washing windows. She was, but she was almost done.

They carefully walked through the house, and ran out the back door toward the barn. Inside they made a plan.

–COME WHAT MAY--

Lizzie returned to the house at approximately 10:20. She went upstairs to her room, but not before stopping by the guest room and staring at Abby. Mrs. Borden hadn’t moved. She was still in that funny position. Lizzie giggled softly to herself again. Very soon after that, she heard Bridget come into the house. Lizzie figured it to be about 10:30 and knew her father would be coming home soon. She sat in her bedroom on her bed and for the first time that day, thought of Emma.

“Emma will be very disappointed in this situation,” Lizzie thought to herself as she counted out more money and placed it into an envelope. The envelope was thick with the folded bills.

Lizzie jumped when she heard the knock at the front door. She got up and stood in her doorway, leaning against the woodwork. She listened as Bridget fumbled at the door trying to unlock it to let Andrew in. Lizzie held the thick envelope full of money in her hand. She looked down at the envelope as her father entered the house. A funny thought entered her brain. Her father was always saying, “One must spend money to make money.” Lizzie thought this quite humourous, considering the circumstances. She couldn’t help but laugh out loud at the thought. But when her laugh faded, she stood in the doorway for five minutes, frozen. She didn’t move a muscle. She didn’t even blink. Her laugh kept echoing in her mind, and it reverberated back and forth against her skull until it was unrecognizable.

She descended the stairs and took a deep breath. She entered the sitting room where Bridget was washing an inside window.

She then went into the dining room, and said hello to her father. “How are you feeling,” she asked him. “Agreeable,” was his response.

“Where is Mrs. Borden,” asked Andrew.

“Um, she received a note in regards to a sick friend and has gone out to visit them.”

Andrew didn’t say anything. He nodded his head, exited the dining room, and made way for his bedroom.

A few minutes later, Andrew returned to the sitting room and sat down upon the sofa. Bridget decided to let him rest and move her work into the dining room.

Bridget entered the dining room and was setting up to begin washing windows. Lizzie decided to get out the ironing board and iron some things. She must do her ordinary chores and remain as normal as possible in front of Bridget.

As Bridget was washing a window, Lizzie nonchalantly asked her if she would be going out this afternoon. Bridget said, “I would rather take a nap than browse the stores”

Lizzie frowned.

Bridget picked up her bucket and went to kitchen to throw out her water. Lizzie trailed behind her. She had already mentioned it to Bridget earlier, but thought it couldn’t hurt to ask again. “There is a dress good sale today. I will give you some money, and if you would like to take the afternoon off to attend the sale, you’re more than welcome.”

“Oh thank you, Lizzie. But, I do believe I will take a nap. I’m feeling very light-headed and ill in my stomach.” Bridget truly was grateful for the offer, and would have taken Lizzie up on it any other day.

“Lizzie is such a kind soul sometimes,” Bridget thought to herself as she climbed the stairs to her bedroom.

–DOING WHAT MUST BE DONE--

The very second Bridget was out of sight, Lizzie went to the sitting room and approached her father. She asked if he was comfortable. If there was anything she could do for him. He said that he wished to be left alone so that he may nap. Lizzie left the room.

Out in the barn, she gave the mysterious man the thick envelope. He had been waiting patiently for Lizzie and had made up his mind that if she didn’t return within five minutes, he was going to leave. He had eaten the three pears Lizzie had given him and he was still hungry; and thirsty to boot. It was too damn hot in the barn and he wanted to get out of Fall River as soon as possible. He had taken off the dress and wadded it up in to a ball. “ It was too hot to wear a dress today,” he chuckled to himself.

“Let that strange gal deal with the dead lady upstairs on her own,” he thought smugly.

Lizzie walked in as he was chuckling. For a strange man she had never met before in her life, she felt like they were old friends. She was oddly comfortable in his presence. Not once did she feel scared or threatened by him. She wasn’t even worried that he would leave the barn in his wait for her to return. She knew he would be standing in the exact spot she left him in. The money in her envelope was power. She knew that and she liked that.

She immediately said, “Maggie is upstairs sleeping. Father is napping on the sofa in the sitting room. You must go in there and do what you have to do right this very second.” She handed him the envelope. He graciously took it, placed it in his pocket, and nodded. He grabbed for the dress and put it back on. As he left the barn, she felt the urge to yell out to him “Be as quiet as possible in the house.” But she didn’t. She knew she didn’t need to.

Lizzie trusted him to do what he needed to do. She had never trusted anyone more in her entire life than that strange man.

–A STRANGE THANK YOU--

Lizzie watched for the man as she stood by the pear tree. In all, she waited two minutes for the man to hurry out of the house and then nonchalantly walk down the sidewalk. He whistled a song as Lizzie watched him walk away. She watched until he disappeared and she could no longer see him.

She slowly left the barn, walked toward the house, and entered the kitchen. She walked straight ahead and entered the sitting room. Her father was lying in the exact same position she had left him in. He looked peaceful and serene, despite the deformed face and bloody mess. Lizzie could look past that. Lizzie sat down next to her father for about a minute and held his hand. She whispered out loud to no one in particular, “Ah...he’s an angel.”

She returned Andrew’s hand back onto his lap and bent down to pick up the red dress the man had thrown onto the floor. She very quietly walked up to her bedroom and took off her dress and wrapped the bloody one inside of it. She hung it up at the back of her closet. She decided to wear something pretty for the afternoon. Lizzie reached for a blue silk dress, one that she liked to wear for special occasions.

Lizzie returned to the first floor. She entered the kitchen and stood at base of the stairs. She wanted to scream loud enough so that the mysterious man whose name she didn’t know could hear her as he walked down the street, blocks away. This would be her personal thank you to the man who changed her life forever.

She slapped each cheek three times as severely as she could. She then grabbed a hold of a small roll of fat on her stomach and pinched as hard as she could possibly muster; her fingers digging into her flesh and drawing blood. While she was still pinching herself, she screamed to Bridget at the top of her lungs.

“Maaaaaaggie!!! Come down so quick! Father is dead....”

One question--- if the man dashed upstairs in a mad panic to hide as quickly as he could, where did the axe come from? He certainly wouldn't be carrying one around with him.

Another question--- how would it be possible for a man (apparently small enough to fit into Lizzie's dress) to kidnap a 200 lb. woman on a very busy street?

Angel @ Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:02 am wrote:One question--- if the man dashed upstairs in a mad panic to hide as quickly as he could, where did the axe come from? He certainly wouldn't be carrying one around with him.

I believe he was carrying a very small pick ax on him. Probably no longer than six inches to eight inches in length. That is why it so difficult to hit Abby hard enough to cause damage. He was very strong, and was hitting her as hard as he could, but the tool was so small that it was actually quite hard to handle. He had to "overkill" her to make sure she was dead. That's why later, I assume he thought to himself that "it would have been easier to kill her if it was a larger hatchet."

Angel @ Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:37 am wrote:Another question--- how would it be possible for a man (apparently small enough to fit into Lizzie's dress) to kidnap a 200 lb. woman on a very busy street?

In my mind, the man was a few inches taller than Lizzie. You're right...the dress wouldn't be a perfect fit, but it went over his head easily and hid his clothes.

I believe as he waited in Lizzie's bedroom, and heard footsteps up the stairs, he knew that that it could possibly be his intended victim. He knew the plan would have to change once she saw him upstairs. He knew the murder would take place on the second story of that house and not out in a secluded area like originally planned.

He quickly grabbed an available dress and was going to use it to cover his clothes. Remember, he has to walk away from the house and down crowded streets. He can't be covered in blood. He was willing to forgo the pride of being seen in a woman's dress in a private home rather than face stares of questioning looks if was walking down a street covered in blood splatter. In my mind, it's actually a strange comedic moment when Abby sees him and Lizzie turns around to see him in her dress. But it wasn't funny for long.

John Morse would know who some of Mrs. Borden's friends and relatives were. The note was probably intended for someone who didn't live in the hustle & bustle of the city, and who would be important enough for Mrs. Borden to want to visit immediately. The man's job would be to follow Mrs. Borden, and and kill her in a secluded area. Probably where there were lots of trees and not a lot of people...

I think there is a misconception about how large Mrs. Borden is. Sure, she weighs two hundred pounds, but that's not so big. I know lots of ladies, short & tall, who weigh near or about 200 pounds. Some of the tall ones who weigh 200 pounds are not really even fat. They're bigger-boned and thick, but not fat. The shorter ones are plump because there's nowhere for the fat to go. I believe, if for some reason I had to, that I could "take on" Mrs. Borden and kill her myself. Not that I would ever do such a thing. But I don't think it would have been difficult for a man to overwhelm her and kill her.

I'm sorry. I'm accidently posted the above post twice.

Elizabelle, true or not, your story/dream/theory is wonderful! I thoroughly enjoyed reading it. It even made me consider some things differently than I ever had before. Plus, you're an excellent writer. Thank you for taking the time and energy to put your thoughts (and well-thought-out thoughts) down, and for sharing with us. Bravo!

Well, there's a different theory! The murder taking place in the woods. Lizzie never would have went to trial had that happened.

Remember, Lizzie didn't get the prussic acid. I think she tried, but ended up using something around the house that had arsenic in it. The Borden's symptoms coincide with it.

The 'girls' had friends. Lizzie had some high society friends thru her church work.

Lizzie did like Abby and called her "Mother", up until five years prior to the murders, when Andrew bought the house for Abby's half-sister.

Lizzie didn't act like she was sick. She just said she was.

I don't see Abby as being greedy. She asked Andrew to help with that house so her half-sister wouldn't get kicked out. It wasn't even for herself.

She had friends, and they spoke extremely well of her. She had friends coming in Monday so she had friends out of town as well. She was close-mouthed about the situation at home with the 'girls'. She didn't go around bad-mouthing them as they did her.

How could the weapon used on Abby leave definite hatchet-like cuts on her head, as we see in her autopsy photo? The contusions on Abby's face were said to have been caused by her fall to the floor. That poor woman. She has always had my sympathy. And she's still getting mistreated by the 'wicked step-mother' description.

What about the coat that was put under Andrew's head? How did that get there?

Good job Elizabelle!

Interesting theory, Elizabelle, thanks for sharing it with us. It was a really good read. Was the red dress the killer wore an image from your dream? I can't picture Lizzie owning a red dress myself. And from Emma's trial testimony it was stated that Lizzie had 8 dresses where the color blue was the featured color.

Yes, I liked it and you did a very good job of writing!

It's also unusual to see someone spill their theory out in *public*. So it's like a gift. Thanks.

I do have some comments, since it's posted here on the Forum.

A good point that is new is that you envision Morse feeling like he would have to support the girls if their father disinherited them. That's interesting, as a motive to help them.

The *delay* by poison is a good interpretation of the illness which befell the Bordens. That was a creative use of that possibility.

The theory that the girls might be paying hush money out until the killer/helper died is a bit hard to believe, because those girls did die with more money than they each inherited, adding to that they lived 35 more years. It just doesn't seem like they paid out a lot of hidden money over time.

The determination was made that Lizzie "was good at lying to your face.* That might be artistic license? Her friends seemed to think that she was truthful in her essential character- that if she killed she wouldn't even lie about it. (Meaning she could kill, but not lie). Granted, it seems like she did lie- so this is debateable.

There's a bit out-of-order where Lizzie offers Bridget money to go shopping before Bridget ever went outside to vomit. All I'm saying is that that was not what Bridget said happened. Also, Lizzie never offered Bridget shopping money- according to both. I think that is some author's construct. It could have happned, but we never heard of it in real life.

Wouldn't they want Abby found very soon? You say the plan was to have her found "rotten and decayed," yet with the change in plan, Lizzie wanted her found in the house pretty badly after Andrew died- within 15 minutes or so even, didn't she? What would be the point of waiting for Abby to be found dead in the woods weeks later? Would they really be able to wait?

Also, when the plan changed, why didn't the killer then go attack Andrew outside somewhere? Why both then in the house. Wouldn't that be twice as bad, to have 2 bodies found in the house, since it wasn't any part of the plan?

In this kind of construct, a failed plan is just about equal to no plan, isn't it?

Then Lizzie now has 2 dresses to dispose of? That is complicated.
You don't need to answer these points I've brought up- I'm only commenting.

But I would like to know the disposition of the 2 dresses now that we have them in Lizzie's hands and she's stuck with them? One was hard enough- why do we need 2?

Lizzie pinching herself before she called down Bridget, in order to give emotional impact to her voice, is a brilliant touch.

I never read this thing.

What little i'm reading Kat seems cool as usual - I was gonna comment - but leftunsaid - great that this girl would do it though!

I don't understand why she would first try to buy prussic acid if she wanted a slow acting poison. Prussic acid is not a slow acting poison. A small amount could kill you instantly.

I can see why the killer would wait for Andrew to come home before killing him once the plan went bad. Two bodies in the house could be a botched robbery, a maniac getting in, all the theories that went around. If someone killed Abby in the house, and then went out to find Andrew and kill him, they ran the risk of being seen. And if Andrew was to die anyway, I don't see whether him dieing in the house would've made it twice as bad. Dead is dead.

There were a few other things that I thought were problematic, but it was a good read. You write well.

It seemed apparent that Lizzie didn't know that 2 hours between deaths would show to the officials.
It's possible that by going out and killing Andrew, then making it appear that Abby came home and surprised a robber and then was killed, would work.
If Abby could be abducted and killed while out, I don't see why Andrew couldn't?

I think, in very small quantities, prussic acid, diluted, was also used as a medicine. It's not unreasonable that it could be used as a medicine, a debilitating poison, or a killing device, depending uopn its solution strength.

OK I have a solid question for you Kat. Did Lizzie own a sealskin cape?

Kat @ Sat Dec 10, 2005 5:12 pm wrote:It seemed apparent that Lizzie didn't know that 2 hours between deaths would show to the officials.
It's possible that by going out and killing Andrew, then making it appear that Abby came home and surprised a robber and then was killed, would work.
If Abby could be abducted and killed while out, I don't see why Andrew couldn't?

So the plan is that the killer is going to 'rob' and kill Andrew somewhere out around town, and then come back to the house and somehow get in through all those locks, try to 'rob' the house also, and kill Abby in the process. Why would the robber come back to the house? I would also think that would point more towards it being an inside job. The person would have to know Andrew's habits and where he goes when he is out. Then they would have to know how to get into the house, and where to go to hide. That seems a lot more complicated than just killing them both in the house. It doesn't make much sense to me to do it that way.

Or the killer is going to kill Abby in the process of 'robbing' the house. Then he is going to leave the house, hunt down Andrew and kill him somewhere out about town. That to me makes even less sense. If he had already robbed the house, where is the need to hunt down Andrew?

Kat @ Sat Dec 10, 2005 5:20 pm wrote:I think, in very small quantities, prussic acid, diluted, was also used as a medicine. It's not unreasonable that it could be used as a medicine, a debilitating poison, or a killing device, depending uopn its solution strength.

But would an amateur killer know how much prussic acid, aka cyanide, to use? The poison was very volatile. Only a tiny amount was used in a solution of water as medicine. I don't think someone without medical knowledge, or a whole lot of experience with killing by poison, would know how much to use without killing someone outright.

If Lizzie was planning to use the poison on A & A, maybe she read up on it a bit beforehand...and didn't broadcast what she was reading or why. I think Lizzie was smart enough to realize that if she shared her idea with anyone...at first anyway...that her cover would certainly be blown...?


Tracy...

I don't mean to argue this position, because it's only a possible scenario, but to be clear, I'm saying that if it's not known to an amateur that the time between deaths would be so apparent (that's the point), then killing Abby in the house (not according to plan), and going out to kill Andrew by waylaying him on his *rounds*, is similar to killing Abby while she is out. But it might be even easier to find Andrew, and divert him to kill him. There's probably a lot of people who would know where he might be and what route he'd take on his business-to-business daily walk.
They would rob him of his keys, expecting to get into the house with them.
A real robber could take him hostage or take his keys to get into his house to rob a rich miser, bump into Abby and kill her (that's their story...).
I think it's as possible a scenario as the one posited.
I don't believe in it- but I don't see too much against it as a quick change of plan.
But since it didn't happen, I guess the theory is moot- but it is interesting to think of other ways to commit this crime.
The more we can do that, the more we might be able to climb our way out of our *box*.

I don't think it matters what poison Lizzie used (or didn't use) to make the Bordens sick.
If Lizzie poisoned those people to stall for time, she could have anything stocked away for the purpose. Dwelling on just prussic acid is almost not relevant, if it's purpose was not to kill- and we know it can be used as a medicine.

Think of this - that Lizzie considered prussic acid, even to the point of trying to purchase it, but then was redirected by someone who knew better than to use it.
Otherwise why would the womanly poision approach fall apart?
According to my Merck (gotta get the new edition before they can't afford paper) arsenic poisioning would result in liver failure, which in two people in the same house, because of it's immediency, would have been noted by the Doctors. Cyanide, of course is instantaneous, which is why they kill moths with it. Who wants the darn things flying around the lights until they die of liver poisioning?
Again, it looks like someone guided her.

I still. go by my former posts on how she was trying to poision them and with what.

wasn't there a book in the sitting room that, after the murders, someone was having a look at and it fell right open to information on some sort of poison...prussic acid perhaps? i can't recall who was examining it at the time. another coincidence?

SGuthmann, I recall reading that too, but, believe it was just a fabrication by one of the Lizzie authors. If I remember it correctly, the author had Knowlton at the house picking up the book. Perhaps it was in Victoria Lincoln's book?

I noticed something interesting on one site that explains the effects of hydrogen cyanide on humans.

"In minimal lethal doses, cyanide affects primarily the central nervous system. Cyanide initially stimulates the peripheral chemoreceptors, causing increased respirations. It also promotes slowing of the heart by stimulating the carotid body receptors. The electrical activity of the brain may stop while the heart is still beating. /Cyanide"

http://www.gasdetection.com/TECH/hcn.html

It slows the heart before the victim actually dies.


"The lethal dose for adults is 200–300 mg of potassium or sodium cyanide, or 50 mg of hydrogen cyanide. When inhaled, HCN is lethal within a few minutes at concentrations of 300 ppm."

You're prettier than your icon, Allen.

Susan @ Tue Dec 13, 2005 9:04 pm wrote:SGuthmann, I recall reading that too, but, believe it was just a fabrication by one of the Lizzie authors. If I remember it correctly, the author had Knowlton at the house picking up the book. Perhaps it was in Victoria Lincoln's book?

It's Pearson. Close
Pearson, Edmund Lester. "A Postscript: The End of the Borden Case." Five Murders. Garden City, NY: Doubleday, Doran & Co., 1928.

I have a chapter here also,called "THE FINAL WORD- The End of the Borden Case," by Pearson, from Masterpieces of Murder, page 268.

"One of these attorneys[for the Commonweath], on entering the Borden house for the first time, found a book of recipes and prescriptions. He took it up, and it fell open in his hand- at the passage devoted to the subject of prussic acid. It is also said that there was evidence of an earlier attempt to procur this poison, earlier than the one made in Fall River the day before the murders. This one took place in New Bedford, and here again the clerk in the pharmacy identified Miss Lizzie as the applicant."

Thanks, Kat. Didn't Lincoln transcribe some of Pearson's stuff verbatim without checking a source. Yes, I've got Lincoln on the brain, but, thats the one Lizzie book thats inscribed in my head, so, when I remember things, its usually from that book.

I didn't know that- did she?
I'm more familiar with Pearson than Lincoln.

Here's another issue - brought up exclusively by you (collectively) - why do you totally discount Pearson and Lincoln on the one hand, yet quote them as experts when you need them?

Lincoln praises Pearson -- and has a quarrel with Radin (without naming him). It's like Radin wanted to debunk Pearson, and then Lincoln debunks Radin.

i learned from experience to distrust Lincoln's transcriptions (i don't know if she lifted them from Pearson or just changed them) -- when i analyzed her solution. specifically, it was about the dresses in the upstairs closet. the article was called "undressing victoria lincoln" or something like that--it was over a year ago. the article was not completely successful, because it got so convoluted -- even though i had an explanation for lincoln's primary error -- i then had to explain on top of it how her transcriptions were wrong as well.

actually Radin has a point about Pearson -- i find at least one important transcription where he deliberately edits out a key part to better make his point. Radin does the same thing though. they're all guilty of it, i guess.

my point is that anyone who trusts their transcriptions will learn better.

This would have been a great theory if published 15+ years ago, before Arnold R. Brown's solution to the case. Did everyone note how this paralleled his solution?
"Todd Lunday" was the first to use an 'unknown subject' as the murderer. If neither Lizzie or Bridget were guilty (they weren't), then it had to be someone else whose presence and identity was kept secret.
Many here seemed to have read too much about this case and not enough about other similar events. There are few true crime stories about a similar unknown murderer (to my knowledge). Aside from Sherlock Holmes, another fictional series would be Perry Mason. His complicated plots ofter arrive at the solution of a person whose presence was unknown, but is developed as part of the story.
Yes, fiction is not reality, but good fiction must reflect reality to be salable. Or maybe not.
I'm sure of two things: 1) the murder of the Bordens will never be solved in court; 2) Arnold R. Brown's solution best explains the mystery.
You are all free to disagree, of course. Its my judgment.

Duplilcate posted in error.
I will do better next time.

this is for real?

surely someone is playing.

Kat @ Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:24 am wrote:I didn't know that- did she?
I'm more familiar with Pearson than Lincoln.

Found it, Kat! Victoria Lincoln's A PRIVATE DISGRACE pg. 62-63:


"Had Mrs. Borden simply felt hate in the air? When Hosea Knowlton, the District Attorney, first entered that house, his eye fell on a book lying on one of the small draped tables in the sitting room. A reader, as the Bordens were not, he picked it up idly. It was a book of household hints; its spine was broken and it fell open at a section on poisons, in fact at an article on prussic acid. Prussic acid works instantaneously and smells like almonds. Lizzie, as we shall see presently, was in no state of mind to cover her tracks just then. Possibly Mrs. Borden, at her daily dusting, had also noticed that her book of household hints had a broken spine."

I, for one, welcome Mellen House Overlords!

Susan @ Wed Dec 14, 2005 9:31 pm wrote:

Kat @ Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:24 am wrote:I didn't know that- did she?
I'm more familiar with Pearson than Lincoln.

Found it, Kat! Victoria Lincoln's A PRIVATE DISGRACE pg. 62-63:


"Had Mrs. Borden simply felt hate in the air? When Hosea Knowlton, the District Attorney, first entered that house, his eye fell on a book lying on one of the small draped tables in the sitting room. A reader, as the Bordens were not, he picked it up idly. It was a book of household hints; its spine was broken and it fell open at a section on poisons, in fact at an article on prussic acid. Prussic acid works instantaneously and smells like almonds. Lizzie, as we shall see presently, was in no state of mind to cover her tracks just then. Possibly Mrs. Borden, at her daily dusting, had also noticed that her book of household hints had a broken spine."

Thanks! I didn't know that!
Of course, Pearson was first.
I'm certainly glad you guys who know the authors can point that stuff out!

Yes, since Pearson was the first to write about that is why I believe that Lincoln lifted it from him and put her own spin on it. If Knowlton had indeed come across this book wouldn't there have been some sort of record or mention in one of the source documents? Perhaps at Lizzie's inquest?

There is a reference in a news item that talks about the gathering of paperwork to present to Knowlton the evening he came to Fall River, which was the eve of the inquest, Monday night. It mentions a book and describes it as like a book druggists write their info in.
I'd have to find the reference. It might be in The Evening Standard. I thought this might be the source of the story.
Harry? Diana?

Is this what you were thinking of, Kat? It’s excerpted from page 2 in the Evening Standard. August 9, 1892

“It was known that City Marshal Hilliard and his allies had reached the point where they needed legal advice and that the marshal had sent for District Attorney Hosea M. Knowlton. Shortly after 5 o’clock the district attorney arrived. He held a brief consultation with Marshal Hilliard, a long talk with Medical Examiner Dolan, and again it looked as if a move was about to be made. Timothy Harrington [another Harrington! BTW], a conductor for the Globe Street Railway Co. who saw Mr. Borden on the morning of the murder and could fix the time accurately, appeared at the station house; so did Officer Harrington with a book on his arm. It closely resembled the book which druggists use for keeping a record of prescriptions and the names of persons purchasing drugs.”

This appeared in the NY Herald, August 9, 1892:

"... The conference had not been going on long when a patrolman came in with one of the registers in which druggist's are required to enter all sales of dangerous drugs. He took this book directly into the room where Knowlton and Hilliard were at work. What it showed nobody knows but the police and the District Attorney, but ever since the murder there has been talk of some such book said to contain a record of the purchase of poison by a member of the Borden household. ..."

As regards the book that Knowlton allegedly found open to prussic acid, I located this in Demille's "Dance of Death", page 62+

"... Hydrocyanic acid is deadly even in small doses, is absorbed by the nervous system, and leaves no traces, producing no postmortem symptoms. There was a well-thumbed book on toxicology found on Lizzie's shelves. But, no matter, the evidence was ruled out because hydrocyanic acid was not the cause of death and because the prosecution could not prove she sought to buy it for criminal purposes, or indeed that it was she in the drugstore. Identification was sketchy. ..."

That's different from Knowlton picking it up accidently on a sitting room table.

Thanks you guys! I can't express how helpful you guys are!
What do you all think? Is it possible this news item about that book on Harrington's arm is the source of the later rumor which Pearson recounted?
"On his arm" sounds like a description of a big book- maybe like a ledger, which would make it more noticeable.

Given any murder inside a house, the prime suspects would be those who lived or visited there. Or may have intruded.
Given the fact that neither Bridget (not a suspect after first day) or Lizzie (accused but correctly found not guilty) then it would have to be an Unknown Subject.

You can research the Marilyn Sheppard Murder for a similar event. The person living there was accused and convicted, but ten years later his wrongful conviction was overturned and he was found not guilty in the second trial. Don't things like this happen today?

In fiction, the search for the real killer generally occupies the story in the book. Unless the identity is known, and the search is to find the killer.

After all that time and that huge reward, the killer was never found.
Even Lizzie and Emma did not really search.
Why didn't they spend their time and Andrew's money trying to solve the case?

Maybe for the same reason O.J. never solved his case (like he said he would)

More of a conjecture in the style of Marie Belloc Lowndes than a theory, I'd say, but very entertaining. Who among us doesn't like to read versions of what might have happened, even if as embroidered and fleshed out as this account was, in order to jog the brain?

Well, I can think of a poster or two among us who has historically preferred to stick to what information is considered unassailable fact (though this has often been a cause for disagreement), but let that pass for now.

Smudgeman @ Wed Jan 04, 2006 7:55 am wrote:Maybe for the same reason O.J. never solved his case (like he said he would)

I can't speak for the wrongfully accused (the ME who did the autopsy said the murders occurred after 11 pm). My answer is that obviously he has none of the powers of a police agency.

In one of the Perry Mason stories (Case of the Long-Legged Models) Perry replies that "murders by organized crime are rarely solved by the police, unless they arrest the wrong man". Was this just fiction?
The corporate press avoided all mention of connections to organized crime in this case. You may find more in some of the books on this case ("Killing Time"). They also point out the similarities in physical description between Nicole's boyfriend (known to visit at night) and Ron Goldman.