Lizzie Borden Society Forum

I happened upon the Discovery channel last evening and found something that I had never seen before. It was an hour long show about Lizzie. One of the first people interviewed was Kat. It was quite interesting because they had modern day detectives and forensic people come in to look at the house and the crime. I was totally weirded out when they sprayed the luminol in the basement and found tons of leftover blood in the ceiling where Andrew's head must have leaked through the floorboards. But the most chilling was the blood around the rim of the dry sink where it appeared someone could have washed off after the crime, and on the wall near the dry sink. It would seem to me that if the murders had been commited by an outsider the person would not have stuck around to go into the basement to take a sponge bath. It's amazing that there was still so much evidence of blood after more than a hundred years.
Another thing they did was fit the broken off handleless hatchet though a slash in Abby's clothing. It fit perfectly.
The most interesting part of the show was when they interviewed a psychologist who said what I have been suspecting all along. She said that the murders were the result of an intense rage, that Andrew showed all the signs of being a sexual abuser (locking everything to the point of paranoia, keeping such a cloistered home, etc), that victims of sexual abuse many times blame both parents (hence the double murder), the abuse being a large reason for Lizzie's dysfunctional behavior, etc. They went through a scenerio where Bridget may have been witness to or immediately after the murders, knew what had been going on and sympathized with Lizzie, so helped her clean up and cover the deed. And that's why Bridget was not as forthcoming as she could have been had she been totally innocent of any knowledge of the crime.

When was this filmed? Were you all aware of this show and I somehow missed all this? It certainly was good. What did you all think of it, those of you who saw it?

After this show another one came on about women serial murderers. I went to bed with visions of Lady Bathory and others dancing through my head, and had some pretty weird dreams, let me tell you. More than enough strangeness for one night.

I saw it too. I looked at the time that it was produced and it said 2004. The show was called "Lizzie Borden took an axe." Thought it was very interesting.

Angel @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:46 am wrote:I happened upon the Discovery channel last evening and found something that I had never seen before. It was an hour long show about Lizzie. ...

Thanks for the warning about this show. How much can you tell in just an hour?

What is a TV show good for? Tittilation, not education.

What was the blood type or DNA? Could someone have planted evidence on the cellar ceiling to impress the paying customer?

Is there any evidence that Andy's blood soaked through the floorboards?

There were alot of errors in the show, but it was good.

I haven't seen it in a long time. Tom Lange was in it, ray- probably your favorite!

But: I see no reason for ray to respond when he hasn't seen the video. That is just fair play as far as I'm concerned.

An interesting side light to the show (at least to me) was that the producer actually phoned Stefani the day of the Luminol testing and asked her where she might suggest they spray, and to call and ask me too! So she called me and I gave my opinion. I wanted them to test for a bllod trail between rooms on the second floor and around the floor and woodwork to Lizzie's doorway and over her threshold. Because she said her door had been locked and I thought if old blood was found over her threshold, it would show a lie. I think a trail of blood might implicate Lizzie even tho many people had lived there. I figured what were the chances of other residents of the house bleeding between the guest room and Lizzie's threshold, or even just at her doorway inside her room.

They had a reason why they couldn't test there- they explained after, to Stef.

Of course we both suggested the cellar ceiling and Stef was told they already were doing that.

Now, a couple of misconceptions:
The title is Lizzie Borden Had An Axe.

I know it is hard to tell, but it was not Abbie's clothing they were matching the HH to, but that *scarf* material that we hardly knew about back then. We had to ask MM after the fact what that was. Apparently it was a large coloured kerchief found near Abby's body but we don't see it in crime scene photos, that we know of. The FRHS has it. It looked in the video to have been cleaned at some point. Probably to help preserve it. Maybe they could have tested that- for someone's blood that was not Abbie's- but then where would they get a sample of Abbie's to compare it to, nowadays?

The area in the cellar where the pan is that glowed under Luminol is not a *dry sink* it is a pan for warming wash water. But we all also know that bleach and other fluids can also glow under Luminol so it could be bleach. We also know that maybe 35 different people have lived in that house over the years- maybe even 50 peope- so if it was biological material it could be from anyone. I never understood why they got so excited about the Luminol in the cellar.

The date on my copy is 11/18/2004.
We *filmed* in March of that year. It was our first trip to Fall River and meeting Len and Bill and MM & Dennis.
We never met Tom Lange, tho he had also been a paid speaker in the Lecture series the First Cong Church used to sponser, where Stef also lectured.

MM & Dennis got out the hatchet and gave me gloves and handed it to me. I got to examine it close up along with Stef.
The producer got all excited. They hadn't thought to ask for it. Once it was out they filmed us with it for a while.
Personally I was interviewed for about 90 minutes and they only used about 2 or 3 minutes. Same for Stef. MM warned us that would happen and also to not expect a pefect product- that one has no control over what makes it into the video.

In The Hatchet article dated Oct/Nov 2004, Tim Evans, in charge of the production, tells about it in his article "A TV Producer Has an Axe: A Look Behind the Scenes of the Lizzie Borden Special."
It is very good!

Also you can see the HH at my profile gallery, if you like:
album_personal.php?user_id=5

I'm glad it was on again. Thanks for bringing it up! I don't get that channel tho.

I was glad for the chance to see Masterton and Rebello- had never seen them before.

I always like watching any Lizzie video!
The World's Creepiest Places has been on many many times this year and I usually watch it when I know it's on!
That's to see Bill Pavao!
I like Haunted New England too- just to see Dennis Binette!
I think any Lizzie video, which brings new interest in the case, is worthwhile!

Again, thanks for bringing this up!