Lizzie Borden Society Forum

Since this was the day of "the hat", what kind did Andrew wear? Am I remembering correctly that he had a black top hat? I don't recall a hat being mentioned when he went downstreet on August 4.

The straw hats with the black bands were popular for men that summer. I can't picture him in one.

I think he was known to wear black all year round.

We did a zoom on the hat on the sittingroom small table to the side of the mantel- it was a straw with a dark ribbon band. Straws were very popular with all ages in the hot months. It may have been Andrew's hat, or even John's or Mr. Walsh's or one of the doctor's-hard to know.

There is a comment in Rebello (pg 25) citing the Aug. 5, 1892 Boston Globe describing Andrew:

"... He was famous for wearing shocking bad hats, and retained a tie until it was almost thread-bare."

Do straw hats and Prince Albert coats go together? Or would Andrew even care. He wore his Prince Albert regularly.

Bowen wore a straw hat. So did Knowlton. Even the stylish reporter Joe Howard wore one to the court proceedings at least once. Add reporter Porter to that list. Martha Chagnon, the young daughter, is shown wearing one in one of the drawings of her.

Lots of straw hats.

If Andrew dressed like that it must have embarrassed the hell out of Lizzie- she was so fashion conscious.

Uncle John was a shabby old dude too. The newspaper mentions his one gray suit he wore all year 'round. Just imagine not being able to take a shower or get into a bath tub- just "birdbaths " in the washbowl daily. Yuck. I bet they didn't even change their undies every day. I remember my ancient grandparents holding forth on the dangers of too much tub bathing and getting caught in a draft, taking a chill while totally naked on the cold tile floors. It must have been a smelly era. Angela Carter does a great job of getting the smells right. No wonder Uncle John was single. And Andrew brushing his teeth in the kitchen sink- gross. :ncool:

It must have been totally disgusting by today's standards. I remember my mother even telling me not to wash my hair so often because it was going to fall out!! If Uncle John wore that suit everyday, how long could it have lasted? The wear & tear must have been awful.

Uncle John did use his suit to his advantage. From the FR Evening News dated Aug. 5, 1892:

"Mr. Morse wears a suit of light grey clothes, all he has with him since he has been in the city. There is not a spot apparent on them. "Look at me," he said, "as a man of common sense, and say if I could have committed such horrible butchery and present the appearance I do."

However at the Preliminary hearing Uncle John spruced up a bit. From the Evening Standard dated Aug. 26, 1892:

"So much has been written about "Uncle" Morse's seedy clothes that it was rather disappointing to find him attired in a good looking suit of black broadcloth and ministerial tie. He had, however, a sunburned hat in his hand that appeared to have been long in the service."

Then on the 27th, same paper:

"When the angular figure of John V. Morse took the stand a fresh wave of interest swept over the court room and every eye was turned toward the witness, and Mr. Morse made an impressive appearance. He wore an iron-gray suit and had a beard of the same color."

This is the first time I've heard that Morse wore something other than that grey suit. If it was black, and he was so cheap, I wonder if it was one of Andrew's?

Well, he might have looked good on the stand from afar, but the reporter who wrote that must not have gotten too close. Any time we discuss Morse, I laugh. What a character.

Shelley - Oh, yeah. The straw hat in the photo. That is so cool to see. It adds every-day reality to the photograph. I would think it was someone other than Andrew's, like you say. When Andrew came home that fateful morn, he first took care of his things before he read his paper and laid/sat down. He hung up his Prince Albert. Surely he put his hat up at the same time.

He must have had some hat on that morning. It was humid, he didn't feel good, the top of his head was bald, I think. And it would be proper attire, which he did strive for.

Harry - You always find something 'new' in old places. Interesting stuff. So Andrew wore a tie till it was thread-bare? Ugh. "Shocking bad hats". What else did they wear, around the 1860's (his material world stopped about then, didn't it, with that outdated furniture?). That intrigues me. What the heck could he have worn? I have it in my mind that he always wore a black top hat. I think the "Legend..." movie helped me with that one. Well, Dr. Seuss hats weren't around yet. I doubt he wore a beanie with a propeller (well, if he could find a real cheap one ...).

Angel - You must be right. That's a good point. She was so fashion conscious.

Nadzieja - Oh, I got a hair washing warning, too, growing up. Mine was only wash your hair once a week, and make sure it's dry before you go to bed; otherwise you'll catch cold. When I got to be 12 or 13, my hair would get oily. I really hated that. When I got to high school, I'd just wash my hair when I took my nightly bath and try to hide it under a hat or pin it up. Got caught. I felt like I had committed some crime. I got a break when I studied hair dressing in high school, and it said in our textbooks how often it was good to wash your hair - and how it wasn't good not to when it needed it. Telling my mom that and that you can't catch a cold from wet hair, I was at last liberated and washed it freely daily. Where do they get this stuff from? I'll bet when they were young, they washed the crap out of their hair.

I wish they would have elaborated on Andrew "cleaning" his teeth in the sink (I think they used the word "cleaning" instead of brushing in testimony). He had some false teeth. Maybe he took those out and cleaned them. We know he was too cheap to buy tooth powder. I thought he must have used baking soda & salt, but maybe he just used water. He may not have even used a toothbrush - maybe he just rinsed his bridge.

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Mmmm...nope. Don't think so.

The above reminds me of the Amish.

A tad too jaunty, perhaps...

Oh, God. Crazy people! I love it! I laughed so hard at that beanie on Andrew. I wasn't expecting that! Very cool, Angel. I do wonder if he found one for free on the street, like that broken lock, he'd wear it. I think he'd at least bring it home.

It was good to see the straw hats on him, Tina-Kate. Now that could have worked fine. YES, it does look Amish. The tilted one was great! So out of character.

Mb, why don't you wear baseball caps with sports on them? Are you not into sports? Do people hiss at you if it's not their team?

JFK hated hats. He had to wear a black top hat at his inaugural, and it drove him nutz. (I think one of the most touching things was when he stood up in his limo and tipped his hat to his father.)

Wasn't a hat for a gentleman in Andrew's time a part of their 'going out' attire?

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That makes sense, mb. I am much like you in that area.

Hockey is a pet peeve of mine. It used to be just the original, what, six teams? And they were all where there was snow and ice, and people played hockey to keep from going nutz during their long winters. The sports were indigenous to those regions.

Nowadays, what is this *%$&#&^ ? We've got the Florida Marlins. the Ducks (ugh - "the Ducks" - I cringe whenever I hear "the Ducks" beat Detroit). My husband and son are huge hockey fans. I'll watch a little and ask "Who they playin'?" And if they name one of those teams, I say, "They don't have ICE!"

YES, mb. The players ought to be from that area (especially the same country). Otherwise, what's the sense? It really wouldn't be Detroit's players winning a game. It's just a collection of round-the-world trades.

Okay, the secret is coming out. I watch 'American Idol'. I think the winner at least ought to be American. Right now, they have a woman from Ireland in the top 4, is it? People that are from Japan try out (I'm not talking about Japanese-Americans. They are Americans.). And a lot from other countries - I know not where, but they're not speaking English.

Are there any real pictures of Andrew wearing a hat? I mean, other than the ones just posted. But, anyway, good job on the photos.

Augusta --- I've played hockey and been a Red Wings fan my whole life.

The Florida Marlins are an MLB team. The Florida Panthers are in the NHL.