Miscellaneous Goodies From My Everything B Disc

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Dec 02, 2023 4:06 am

lizzyborden2.jpeg

lizzyborden3.jpeg

Just spare items from my files:
The Legend of Lizzie Borden scenes…

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Dec 02, 2023 4:10 am

LizzieInMovieSHOT.jpeg

This never happened! We would more likely see Lizzie given drops of some sort, yes?
Thinking the shot in the arm is for modern audiences so there’s no question that Lizzie is getting morphine.

Does this look like the dress at the B&B?

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Sat Dec 02, 2023 7:25 am

I bet you are right....Lizzie swallowing a pill or drinking a potion has no dramatic flare compared to a needle thrust into her arm.

They could have at least had the artwork above Andrew's sofa be square vs. circular.

I'm am still working on the analysis of when Morse arrived at the Borden home. Taking me longer than I had thought because trying to avoid loose ends. The process is reminding me that if anyone wants to form an opinion or theory contingent on the happenings during the couple hours after the murders, they need to read EVERYTHING and not lean into individual, isolated comments, remembrances, or actions; which of course, is what we all invariably tend to do.

On a completely unrelated note, my wife is up in Kansas City this weekend and I hear it is very cold, slushy wet and overcast. Days like today, I sure am grateful for where I reside! Hint - palm trees grow here.

p.s. I've got a little game for anyone to participate. If we were movie directors and making a Lizzie movie, who would we choose as our cast? I just thought of this 'game', so I'll post my thoughts after I have a couple more cups of coffee.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 03, 2023 2:05 am

End of hurricane season here!

Boy, are you right about comparing Testimonies to get at a timeline or a near concesus amongst the characters in the case as to what happened when and where they were at the time, who said what etc… and then they say it differently later.

Good

luck!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 03, 2023 2:10 am

More offerings- this you may have seen. But see the note in the left upper corner by moi- this complaint was written to a previous law partner of Attny Jennings!
(R.= Rebello)

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 03, 2023 2:14 am

Harry follows next with a FAKE FOTO
Plz clic on pic

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Sun Dec 03, 2023 10:44 pm

This is a postcard from the Fall River Public Library. It is an intersection of Pleasant and some other street in downtown Fall River. No vehicles in sight, so I'm thinking this is a scene from the 1890's. I tried to identify the intersection. I think its either Pleasant & Second Street or Pleasant & Main St.

But please, anyone take a go at identifying the intersection. Thanks!

Pleasant & Second is the intersection where John Morse got off the streetcar on his way back to the Borden house from his call on the Emery's.

If the first building on the right is the Academy of Music and first building on left is the Pocasset Block, then this is a view from intersection of Main St. & Pleasant, looking east. The second option is that this is one block east and is the intersection of Pleasant & Second St. looking east.

On the right side is a "Foster's" which I think is a pawnshop at 35 Pleasant. 26 Pleasant was a restaurant and there is a Chinese restaurant on the left side. Road slightly curves in the distance, similar to the map. Also second street on the right side isn't a straight shot from Second street on the left. Look at the map below. It looks similar.

Screenshot 2023-12-03 230841.png

Screenshot 2023-12-03 223115.png

This postcard view is an extension of the photos above of Pleasant St. You can see the "Job Printing" sign in lower right corner. That same sign is halfway back on the right in the top photos.

Screenshot 2023-12-17 103908.png

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Tue Dec 05, 2023 3:33 am

I’m a little confused about the map.
May I show one I did that I think give’s Morse’s route to Weybosset?
It’s been a while, so if we concur it’s correct (except for the dots on Third? Why do I have dots on Third?), are you more interested in the detail of his return trek?
Maybe we could plot that too.
Where should I look for his description?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 10, 2023 3:12 am

Map to be continued….

Meanwhile…!
FakeFoto- The Dress!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 10, 2023 3:19 am

Well, wrong time of year but goes with “The Dress!”

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 10, 2023 3:24 am

I like this “woman’s view” of Lizzie at trial.
Sorry, no attribution.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 6:15 am

IMG_2106.jpeg

Yes, Legend of Lizzie Borden dress
I don’t recall ever seeing the tag in real life…

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 6:18 am

Contemporary train schedule- probably the format Dr Bowen looked at quickly before ordering Emma home. Plz click on pics

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 4:49 pm

Thanks for sharing!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 10:57 pm

Yr welcome- still looking at my files

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:05 pm

Thank you too, for yr offerings!

This is a newspaper drawing of the barn loft

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:07 pm

Lizzie faints- I had colored this a very long time ago…3 computers ago

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:14 pm

Inside Leary Press
If someone was in there and has a photo, plz add it?

Plz clic on pic

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:17 pm

Abraham and closest family members from Harry

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 18, 2023 11:38 pm

Nellie Miller, friend of Forum member “gramma”’s gramma.
I don’t know which is which in the pic, sorry

Rebello, pg 338+
Lizzie Borden’s will

19. To my housekeeper, Ellen B. Miller, always called Nellie, all the contents of her room if she wants them.

Profile: Miss Ellen "Nellie" Miller was born in Bolton, England, in May 1890. She was the daughter of James T. Miller and Jane (Bennett) Miller. Ellen's sister, Jane, was born in 1895. She also had a brother, Alfred. Miss Miller's father, a widower, died in 1904 at the age of 43, leaving Nellie and her sister Jennie "Jane" to live with an aunt and uncle, Cyrus and Mary Miller. Mr. Cyrus Miller died on November 17, 1905, at the age of 52. The whereabouts of Nellie's brother after the death of their father is unknown. He is listed in his Aunt Mary's obituary as a nephew from Washington, D.C. in 1939. The remaining household consisted of Nellie's aunt Mary, her daughter; Winifred, a
nurse; Nellie and her sister Jennie "Jane", a school teacher in Fall River.

Miss Miller began her employment as a housekeeper and maid at Maplecroft in 1914 at the age of twenty-six. She resided with Lizzie for thirteen years. After Lizzie's death in 1927, Miss Miller went to live with her sister Jane, her cousin Winifred and her aunt Mary in Fall River. Nellie continued to work as a domestic after Lizzie died. Miss Miller's aunt died in 1939. Her cousin, Winifred, died in 1960.

Miss Ellen "Nellie" Miller died in Fall River on November 11, 1980. She was in her 92nd year. She was a former Sunday school teacher, as well as a member of Union United Methodist Church in Fall River, the Sunshine Circle, and the Fall River Women's Club. Waring- Ashton conducted the funeral services. She was survived by her sister Miss Jane B. Miller, a cousin, and two nieces. Miss Jane B. Miller died in Fall River on March 1, 1981. They are both buried at Oak Grove Cemetery.

According to Ellen Miller's will, written on June 6, 1980, she left her sister Jane, "furniture and furnishings and personal effects, as well as all of my tangible personal property," (Will, p.1). The remaining estate, "Property, real, personal or mixed..." held by a trust fund created by an Indenture of Trust. The Bank of New England was named as executor.

Ellen Miller's sister, Jane Miller, wrote her will three months before she died (December 22, 1980). She left an estate of $100,000 to her cousins, friends and church.

Note: Miss Ellen Miller inherited $3,000 under Lizzie's will p. l, Sec. 2, "To my housekeeper and to each one of the servants who shall have been with me for five years and shall be in my employ at the time of my death the sum of three thousand dollars."

Reasonwhy · Post by **Reasonwhy** » Tue Dec 19, 2023 5:00 pm

Your goodies are treasures, indeed, Kat! Thanks for ALL of your generous posts, with the countless hours of work which went into researching and gathering.

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Tue Dec 19, 2023 7:14 pm

Hi Reason!

Kat - am I tracking the names on the headstones correctly.....did Abraham name two of his daughters Lurana? Also, I seem to recall that the newspaper that had the drawing of the barn loft, also had a drawing looking up at the back of the barns upper window and showed the pigeon coop. Do you happen to have that 'handy'?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Dec 20, 2023 1:36 am

Thank you reasonwhy- nice to see you! It does take several hours a week to go through my disc, and finally naming my pictures so I can find them again!

Camgarsky, the barn pic was from the “Did She Didn’t She” oversized book- do you see another pic in there?
Good question about Lurana…I just saved out Hiram and wife headstone early today:
Plz clic on pic

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Dec 20, 2023 3:29 am

Signatures from account book eBay. March-April 2002.
When shares dividends were paid out the client had to sign.
Andrew Borden signed as POA for Mary Ann Borden.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Dec 20, 2023 5:15 am

This will drive you crazy- don’t stare too long and get hypnotized.
Must click on pic to see magic

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Wed Dec 20, 2023 7:39 am

I was looking for the illustration of the pigeon coop and found this somewhat 'creepy' drawing. I presume that is Jennings.

Screenshot 2023-12-20 073319.png

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 1:26 am

I am not insensitive to the gravity of the situation we study here, but occasionally there is an out-loud chuckle and this was one of them!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 1:36 am

Here’s a sentimental human interest story- and leaves one wondering what created and continued the *estrangement*. (For what it’s worth, and not verified against any other paper.)

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 1:51 am

This is the great showpiece estate and private home called Interlaken which is no more.

This is a postcard.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 2:00 am

And this is literally one of the last pieces of decorative tile left from the site. (It lays on my scarf here)
The place has crumbled. It’s a shame.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 4:55 am

https://lizzieandrewborden.com/HatchetO ... aters.html

From The Hatchet article by Michael Brimbau- Stef is in one of the pictures.
Spencer Borden’s residence, Interlaken

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 7:57 am

What a beautiful mansion! Did it burn down? Presumably it sat up high with a gorgeous view....surprised something wasn't built there to take advantage of the setting.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 11:19 pm

Quote from the article (from the link), by MB

Not long after Col. Spencer Borden’s death, Interlachen, and the “Big House” was sold. Sometime later, in the late 1930s, the city was given the opportunity it always desired. Finally, it had snatched the shiny brass ring—sole possession of Interlachen. But the prize would not shimmer for very much longer. In all their wisdom and with blind prudence, Fall River had Interlachen, the “Big House,” demolished. Merchants and hawkers stripped the impressive three-story mansion of its entire oak paneling, windows, and anything else of value it could ravish. By the 1940s, the entire island became the possession of the Fall River Water Department. And finally, RT 24 was constructed, becoming a natural barrier from intruders between New Boston Road and the island. Like a lost forgotten land, Interlachen has stood undisturbed for over 65 years. Though its countless potentials are inviting, it is probably best left alone as open undeveloped space and used for rustic historical nature walks such as the ones given by Bill Goncalo.

—Apparently it’s spelled “Interlachen”

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Dec 22, 2023 11:52 pm

When Ron Evans and Martha McGinn (who had inherited the Second Street house from her father) did renovation work on the place, the exterior chimney stack needed repair. Some bricks coming out of the original chimney were stored in the cellar and occasionally the curator of the house, after it became a B&B, Bill Pavao, might spontaneously gift some lucky person an original brick.
Stef and I were lucky people that first day I visited, when we were all making the Discovery video.
Here is my brick from that memorable tour, where I was allowed access to everywhere except a bedroom in the attic which was occupied.

Brick in my left hand and flashlight in my right, in the cellar of Second Street. Bill Pavao (who always plays Billy Borden in the videos) headless to my left behind me. March, 2004.

BTW: this is Bridget’s laundry area, and where Bill is standing would be about where the bloody clothes were stored overnight, Thursday to Friday.

P1010058.jpeg

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Dec 23, 2023 2:51 am

Oak Grove Cemetery map. Harry and I had worked on a project together compiling case related names and plotting them on the map and taking a picture of the gravestone, and we were going to add a short bio on each, thinking our Borden case researchers might find it useful and interesting.
We were about 2/3 thru, when we realized Harry could not do another Fall River trip because of multiple health concerns. The project was suspended. I have blotted out numbers, using white. Tommy, who was the Director of Parks and Trees, took a shine to Harry, they were of an age and had a lot in common- he offered to be available if needed, and also supplied the map.

At this point, I can only think maybe Borden scholars, and enthusiasts, would want to make discoveries on their own.

It’s in 2 pieces- sorry, don’t know how to put them together.
The wider avenues are “streets” and the smaller routes are “paths.”

OakGroveMapPt2.jpeg

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Sat Dec 23, 2023 10:53 am

Kat -- is the window behind you one of the windows that officer hyde looked thru? To help with spatial aspects, how far behind Bill was the sink and cellar wall?

Reason -- were you able to get any washroom pics when you visited the house?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Dec 23, 2023 9:28 pm

It’s a good question- My annotated plan of the cellar will show #27 states *window(s) Hyde looked through*- the East window and then he moved to the South window. There are 2 South windows to the laundry area, but Hyde used the first one closer to the sink
But please check it out, in the Hatchet~ here is the link. When you look at the pictures, you can clic on each and they get bigger. It will provide better context for you.
Article by moi, The Borden House Frame by Frame, the Cellar
https://lizzieandrewborden.com/HatchetO ... art-4.html

Plz note the placement of the water heater when defining the area. There are a series of photos in the article, and the end one in the first series relates to the first one on the left in the lower series. That wall right in front of me continues to the right where the wash pan is embedded in the brick, for reference. Also note the last pic in series was taken by opening the kitchen door - which did not exist until Mr McGinn installed it to get to his Leary Press- and leaning out to see the side of the house that was covered by the Press. I wanted a picture of the cellar windows from the outside. It was very awkward. Stef took that pic and provided the caption, but I think the new kitchen door was between the 2 windows- it’s the only thing I can think of to account for only one picture of A cellar window in the laundry area from the outside vantage point.

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Sat Dec 23, 2023 11:17 pm

Excellent article!

Lizzie's solo 2nd trip to the cellar is right there with half dozen other behaviors or statements by Lizzie that just can't be explained away when you view them in totality. Folks can scoff at their indication of guilt, one at a time. But when viewed together, pretty much impossible that they don't suggest Lizzie never shared the much of the story of that morning.

Cellar trip, burn dress, note delivery, Abby home, screen repair or sinker alibi, Sargent's cloth sale....these are just the headliners.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 3:57 am

Thanks! At the time, I became an expert on the cellar and was down there all the time, even helping Lee-Ann bring in groceries up and down those outside steps.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 4:00 am

More - for when you visit Fall River!
You will probably still get lost…everybody does.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 4:04 am

LBQ- poor Lil’ Abbie. Has anyone gone after Victoria Lincoln’s papers?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 4:06 am

1961, do not know paper, sorry- but….huh?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 4:18 am

Hopefully no one minds an interruption to the theme here to plz enjoy the Christmas Eve 4 a.m. full moon outside my breezeway, Central Florida

plzcliconpic

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 4:28 am

For the Borden family in happier days…

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 10:44 am

Random comments and question.....

1) Lil Abby wrong - Lizzie went to Europe in 1890 and Andrew bought back 12 Ferry in 1892. That obviously isn't how Lizzie got the Europe $.
That basic 'miss' brings everything else she states into question.
2) Roughly, how what would you guess the dimensions of the cellar washroom? I've sort of thought 10 ft x 10 ft.....what say you?
3) Absolutely wonderful Christmas Eve moon shot from your patio!

Happy Christmas Eve!!

Reasonwhy · Post by **Reasonwhy** » Sun Dec 24, 2023 11:05 pm

Merry Christmas, Camgarsky and Kat!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 25, 2023 4:20 am

Yes Thank you and Merry Christmas to All!

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Mon Dec 25, 2023 8:18 am

Merry Christmas back to both of you!!!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:58 am

Borden & Almy receipt : I think they had a female clerk because of the flowery writing? April 17, 1875.
I wonder who wrote this?
Can anyone read this? 75 camp chairs?
Is there a “Box” and a “Coffin”?

camgarsky4 · Post by **camgarsky4** » Fri Jan 05, 2024 12:18 pm

I read it as....
1 Casket less plate & handling
1 box
Use of 75 camp chairs
Would be wildly guessing on the remaining couple items. Not sure what 'plate' would be. Name plate? Was the box for ashes and the casket for show? Guessing on all that.