If Lizzie would have had to work cuz Andrew remained poor

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 6:49 pm

Just curious, if Andrew, who came from the poor side of the family, never made mone, what line of work would lizzie be doing? I mean, obiviously, she would have had to go to work. She wouldn't have been living off her father because he didn't have any money. Would she be a flower girl, a maid, a teacher what?

Allen · Post by **Allen** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 10:32 pm

snokkums @ Thu Aug 31, 2006 5:49 pm wrote:Just curious, if Andrew, who came from the poor side of the family, never made mone, what line of work would lizzie be doing? I mean, obiviously, she would have had to go to work. She wouldn't have been living off her father because he didn't have any money. Would she be a flower girl, a maid, a teacher what?

Or maybe a waitress?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 11:38 pm

Most of Lizzie's earlier friends were teachers, as were some of her cousins. And since she did some sort of Sunday school teaching, I would guess she would like to be a regular teacher.
I'm not sure of the training involved tho. I would think she would need more schooling first.

Why a waitress?

Elizabelle · Post by **Elizabelle** » Fri Sep 01, 2006 8:30 am

I think she would be a prositute.

A dirty little slut, that one! The best in Masachusetts...so good that all the Johnnies come from as far as Virginia to meet the infamous "Love Ya Up & Down And All Around, Miss Lizzie Borden."

She would have been famous, no matter what. Either a famous murderess or a famous slut; depending on the circumstances.

We all know how it turned out though, don't we?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:10 am

That is kind of weird.
Maybe I misunderstood the question.

doug65oh · Post by **doug65oh** » Sat Sep 02, 2006 9:49 pm

I think this might be where the first few bars of "The Twilight Zone" music would go...

Allen · Post by **Allen** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:12 am

Kat @ Thu Aug 31, 2006 10:38 pm wrote:
Why a waitress?

I was just making joke.

Sorry. I suggested it because of the story of her helping to serve meals during the holidays at the soup kitchen.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Sep 03, 2006 4:45 am

Oh OK thanks Missy!

Maybe Elizabelle was joking too?

Elizabelle · Post by **Elizabelle** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 10:42 am

Kat @ Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:45 am wrote:Oh OK thanks Missy!

Maybe Elizabelle was joking too?

Yes, I was.

I would hope that the four laughing smilies, and one winking smiley I used, would insinuate that I was joking.

Do people have a sense of humor? Because if not, I'll quit making tongue-in-cheek posts.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 1:39 pm

A waitress is good. Or a bar maid perhaps?

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:22 pm

Lizzie might have been a very good actress.

Smudgeman · Post by **Smudgeman** » Mon Sep 04, 2006 4:54 pm

Or a flower girl who also pic-pockets on the side

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:13 pm

Elizabelle @ Mon Sep 04, 2006 10:42 am wrote:
Kat @ Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:45 am wrote:Oh OK thanks Missy!

Maybe Elizabelle was joking too?

Yes, I was.

I would hope that the four laughing smilies, and one winking smiley I used, would insinuate that I was joking.

Do people have a sense of humor? Because if not, I'll quit making tongue-in-cheek posts.

You should know that most people do not like their hobby or job being joked about.

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:14 pm

Elizabelle @ Mon Sep 04, 2006 10:42 am wrote:
Kat @ Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:45 am wrote:Oh OK thanks Missy!

Maybe Elizabelle was joking too?

Yes, I was.

I would hope that the four laughing smilies, and one winking smiley I used, would insinuate that I was joking.

Do people have a sense of humor? Because if not, I'll quit making tongue-in-cheek posts.

You should know that most people do not like their hobby or job being joked about.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:03 pm

I like the flower girl; just like eliza dolittle in my fair lady. Maybe some rich dude will teach her how to speak properly? lol

Wordweaver · Post by **Wordweaver** » Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:51 pm

If Andrew hadn't made money, the girls might well have married. Most women did.

Which brings us to the question: why didn't either Emma or Lizzie marry? Did their father's money have anything to do with their staying single? How about their father's personality?

Otherwise, the jobs available to women in 19th century Massachusetts included mill work, teaching, seamstressing, and domestic service.

Lynn

RayS · Post by **RayS** » Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:03 pm

Wordweaver @ Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:51 pm wrote:If Andrew hadn't made money, the girls might well have married. Most women did.

Which brings us to the question: why didn't either Emma or Lizzie marry? Did their father's money have anything to do with their staying single? How about their father's personality?

Otherwise, the jobs available to women in 19th century Massachusetts included mill work, teaching, seamstressing, and domestic service.

Lynn

Arnold Brown explains it by saying anyone who was not as rich would be dismissed by Andy as a fortune hunter. True! But anyone as rich as Andy would supposedly find a better mate than the daughter of a nouveau riche (her granpa was a fish peddler!!!).
Some have speculated about Emma because of her reclusive habits. Was she put down by her parents? The effects of her upbringing by her Mom (reputedly had a temper)?

They say if you want to know what your girlfriend will be in 20 years, look at her mother. True? You ladies can agree or disagree.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:29 am

Wordweaver @ Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:51 pm wrote:If Andrew hadn't made money, the girls might well have married. Most women did.

Which brings us to the question: why didn't either Emma or Lizzie marry? Did their father's money have anything to do with their staying single? How about their father's personality?

Otherwise, the jobs available to women in 19th century Massachusetts included mill work, teaching, seamstressing, and domestic service.

Lynn

I read in some notes by a colleague who is since passed away, that it is possible that Andrew preferred his daughters not to marry because of what his wife Sarah may have gone thru with her pregnancies and dying too soon after Lizzie's birth.
It may have scarred him or scared him, who knows?

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 7:33 am

I think both are true. Anyone could have been considered a gold digger and he might have worried they would die in childbirth too. Or both of them were closet homosexuals and were afraid to come out.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Sep 08, 2006 5:10 pm

We also should consider that the Civil War wiped out a lot of otherwise somewhat eligible men who might have been the right age for Emma at least.
Didn't the eldest girl marry first? Or was that just in romance novels in England?

Ms. Jo · Post by **Ms. Jo** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:52 am

From what I have read about Emma, she was the quiet introvert type personality..set in her ways, & like her father, very careful with her money. Lizzie on the other hand, outgoing, wanting to show & spend the wealth. They both probably didn't marry for the same reason. They wanted to keep their money to themselves...Didn't your spouse back in those days, have control over their wife's money, inheritance, etc....They probably both, had enough of their father "ruling the roost", during their/his lifetime, not to want to have to share any wealth,(once they had it of course) with anyone.

DWilly · Post by **DWilly** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 10:32 am

There are a lot of reasons why Lizzie and Emma never married. With regard to Emma I can think of at least two other reasons:

Emma may have felt an obligation to take care of Lizzie and felt she could not marry and leave Lizzie alone to be raised by Abby.

It is also possible no man found Emma attractive enough to marry. This is just my opinion but, from what I have read Emma was not a pretty woman. Plus, she did not seem to be much fun. It was Lizzie who was the more outgoing of the two. Men may have found Emma to be just too boring to marry. I think part of this may have been due to Emma never really recovering over her Mother's death. She just never got on with life after her Mother's death.

As for Lizzie, well, it could be Men also found her personality a bit much. Not boring like Emma but maybe just to bossy, weird etc.

And as I have said before it is also possible that Lizzie just was not keen on getting married. Yes, she had a few dates but no one ever mentioned her going out with one guy or having any big romance. In my opinion if Lizzie had really wanted to get married she would have. She just did not want to. Rebello does provide many articles where time and again folks said Lizzie was not interested in marriage. Why? In the end I do not know. Possible reasons: Wanted the money all to herself, could have been a lesbian, just like being independent, fear of sex, only attracted to married men etc. Many reasons.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:09 am

I think that she was either gay or she was afraid of sex.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:22 pm

I think she'd had her fill of male domination and yes Ms. Jo, men got their wive's money. 2 good reason's not to marry.

But if they were poor and had no money, would Lizzie have stayed single or tried to better her lot in life thru marriage?
I think she would have married rather than work.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 4:01 pm

She might have improved her lot in life if she did marry. Marry up so to speak.

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If Lizzie would have had to work cuz Andrew remained poor

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