Notes from Lizzie Borden Play and talk at high school

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Sun Apr 05, 2009 2:17 pm

I understood that the radiator WAS the murder weapon, something I heard at a school play recently....

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sun Apr 05, 2009 2:40 pm

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Sun Apr 05, 2009 4:44 pm

Considering the radiator was on the other side of the room at the time- that was SOME fancy slicing and dicing.

Bob Gutowski · Post by **Bob Gutowski** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 11:16 am

I can't imagine how Jules, once so respected, has fallen so far off the track. I also don't see how repeatedly and "gently" pointing out his mistakes during the lecture would've been any kinder than a well-worded single objection to his multiple errors. You're not going to make him love you for it in either case.

But then, I am BOB GUTOWSKI, the scourge and self-appointed corrector of Karen Cheney!!!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 12:37 pm

Oh come on to lunch MB with me and Jules and Stef- maybe together we can all keep each other sane and figure out what ails this guy. I would have opted for medication as the cause, but am not sure that is still the case. In fact someone recently said he had remarried. It's all quite a mystery where this is coming from. I hope it is not dementia or Alzheimers. Hopefully now the play is over, this business will not be repeated upon the unsuspecting and trusting ears of others. My daughters promise to "lock me up" one day when I start sputtering silly drivel and embarrass myself. Actually that is already happening and they let me know about it every chance they get. Kids.

You do not want to meet my sister unless she is taking her meds. Seriously.

Phooey, Bob- everyone knows you are a sweetiepie! Scourge indeed!

Bob Gutowski · Post by **Bob Gutowski** » Mon Apr 06, 2009 1:37 pm

And a hug to you, ma cherie!

I've been in an large audience listening to Stephen Sondheim discuss his work, and have heard him say "I don't like to go back and rewrite."

As he is one of the notorious "Hmm, let me try THIS instead" guys of all time, a few hundred very repectful jaws hit the floor at once.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:26 am

Yes, by now some of you are ready to shake me.

Poor Mr. Ryckebusch: At least Evan Hunter wrote his lustful and and erotic ideas in fiction. Old Jules ideas run along the vein of truth, or at least how he sees the truth, making Lizzie out to be lascivious, oversexed sicko.

In an article fro the New York Times old Jules was quoted asserting that Abby caught Lizzie "masturbating for all I know", and that "Lizzie was enraged", and I suppose the discovery left her with no outcome but to kill Abby.

He further adds: "there's an almost Erotic association with that kind of violence."

Jules also implies that Lizzie had a climax while killing her father, stating: "Lizzie knew her father would know what happened, (that she was masturbating, thus) so she had to kill him. The killing released something, something like an Orgasm."

For those who think that something has happened to the man in his old age, let me assure you, you are fooling yourself. This article was written 17 years ago and Ryckebusch is still going strong making things up, mis-leading the public.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:30 am

Oh my. . . . well, meds, mental health, and ageing, and some unresolved childhood issues perhaps

As far as some kinds of violence and erotic association-that link has been around and proven for years. Seems to be mostly a male thing though, with both hetero and homosexual male killers - Tony Curtis in the Boston Strangler- chilling. . .

Yooper · Post by **Yooper** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 10:04 am

Is it reasonable to expect that Ryckebusch has never been challenged with respect to his information on the Borden case if he has been at it for several years? If he has, it apparently has done no good. Maybe audiences have a taste for the sensational and the hyperbole is just what they are seeking. There is a segment of the population which doesn't want to be confused with the facts or the truth, so maybe there is little to gain by challenging him.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 1:12 pm

Yes Yooper, what you add is all correct.

You have this man with all these credentials and degrees and people have a respect for that. This is very similar to some of us who see medical doctors on par with god. (G?)

Thus people say:

How can he be wrong.

Shhhhh, he is speaking.

Wow, I never knew that......

Yes, I remember reading that in Hunter, Speiring, Lincoln and other experts who wrote on the case.

The general public have little time and interest enough to go look up the truth for themselves. And, unless you study the case for yourself, reading the authors above just adds to Ryckebusch's deceptions.

One must be acquainted with Jules. Once this is done you would quickly see that this man loves attention, loves to talk.

The reason I am so critical of him is because he is a teacher. Just behind M.D's. teachers are probably the next most respected vocation. There is no excuse for such a person to spread exaggerations.

And, people who lie and make things up forget or come to believe their own embroided embellishments.

A good example of this is Ryckebusch in the little film I posted above stating that a piece of Abby's head flew UNDER the radiator and at the meeting at Durfee he claimed that a piece of Abby's head flew ON TOP of the radiator.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Fri Apr 10, 2009 2:59 pm

As an expert Mr Ryckebucsh has written very little about the case.

He should go on the record and write a book.

Of course, this would make for very delicate admission.

He would need to remember everything he ever said about the case, on stage or in the classroom.

Do not those who call themselves experts on a topic write books on their subject of expertise, and publish countless papers on the issues?

Once one studies Ryckebusch they find that he has written very little to nothing.

He just edited LBQ. He submitted very little himself.

He receives the acclaim and everyone else does the work.

There is no bigger proof of that then the book he edited, PROCEEDINGS.

So, come on Jules, write us a book.

Oh yes, one about the case not about you.......