What would Lizzie have thought.

[snokkums]

I got to thinking the other day about all the cool stuff we have today. Like c-phones, e-mails computers plasma TV's .We can get to Europe by plane in about 7 hours, where ion Lizzies' day, it took a couple of months by ship.

Just for fun, I wonder whatg Lizzie would have thought of all that we have today. I bet she'd have a c-phone for sure. Probably take a plane trip around the world! And of course, the best car that money can buy! Like mercedes or a Lexus. I think I am having to much fun with this. I just bet she'd have a good time, much to the dimay of her sister Emma.

Emma, I don't think would have been spending like Lizzie would have done. She's alittle more reserved.

What do you all think?

[Miranda]

If Lizzie had been born 100 years later, this probably would never have happened. She could have made a life for herself and not had to put up with her father's stinginess. Also, IF (big IF) she was epileptic, she would have received medical and probably financial help. IF (another big IF) there was some incest going on, she could have maybe got help.

i have always pitied Lizzie more than anything else.

[mbhenty]

YES:

I don't believe for a minute that Lizzie Borden was an epileptic.

This was a framework for the writing of a book, Victoria Lincoln's book, A Private Disgrace. Though Victoria lived in Fall River and probably knew many people who knew Lizzie, it is my belief that she made it up. To sell her book. There is absolutely no proof or evidence that Lizzie was epileptic.

Of course there is no proof that she was not, thus there may be some who subscribe to such rubbish. But, you must forgive me for being so belligerent about my declaration. Writers with the public's ear should be more responsible in their essays.(not you, of course, I'm talking about writers such as Lincoln, Spiering, and Brown, etc.) Perhaps Victoria really believed what she wrote, and that's ok. But, there is no proof that people with epilepsy go around killing people while undergoing an epileptic convulsion or seizure, as she declared. Bad Vicky, bad, bad Vicky.

As for incest.......please don't get me started.

The narrative above aside............Welcome Miranda. I see that this is your first post. Great. Hope to see you post more often. Things have been slow here on the forum. Hope your stay here is a pleasant one. Funny! I just got home an hour ago from having supper with my friend Miranda.

[Miranda]

Thank you for the welcome :) i have been lurking here for a looooong time. I know it's slow, but i like it just fine.

i agree with you, i dont believe in the epilepsy or the incest stories. but i do believe that Andrew probably made both "girls" miserable in so many ways. it was probably normal for the times, but still miserable.

[snokkums]

I don't know wether or not she had epilepsy, something like that wouldn't have been public knowledge. Most of the time, people were put in the mental institution if they had epilepsy; it was considered a mental condition.

I think that Andrew made them miserable, that was one of the reasons I asked what would she be buying if she were alive today.I think she would be going nuts getting stuff because of her father.
And welcome to the forum Miranda, think you'll like it here.

[Miranda]

if it were me, more comfortable clothes!

the dresses we see her in look so uncomfortable!

[snokkums]

I hear you on that one. The corest alone don't look comfortable. The shoes too don't look to comfortable either.

[Angel]

I have never understood why some people are so belligerently against the possiblity of incest in Lizzie's home. Why is this not worth pursuing? A lot of things indicate this could have happened. The kleptomania, the constantly locked doors, the insistance of Andrew to have control over everything. One must keep an open mind when exploring all possibilities in order to remain objective as a sleuth.

[SallyG]

I agree, Angel. Incest knows no boundaries. It happens in the "best" of families. I have never seen or heard any evidence that completely disputes the theory of incest as a motive!! Until that happens, I will keep an open mind. It's quite obvious that SOMETHING drove Lizzie to murder! Unless one knew Andrew Borden so personally that one knew with 100% certainty that incest was impossible (such as a doctor who knew he had been impotent for 30 years, etc.), I fail to see how incest could be ruled out! In fact, I would tend to question WHY someone would be so insistent that incest was NOT possible!

[Angel]

Amen and hallelujah!

[Smudgeman]

Incest is defintely a possibility, but I am afraid we will never know the truth. The only people that would have known about it were Lizzie, possibly Abby if she knew and kept quiet. Maybe Emma or even Dr. Bowen. I still tend to believe that Lizzie did what she did, because she wanted her "fair" share of Andrew's money, she could have blown the whistle at any time otherwise and ended up with nothing but sympathy.

[snokkums]

I think the incest happened. I think that was more of the motive than the money. I think where the money came in, is where the murder of Abby came in. She didn't want Abby getting the money. I think the motive for Andrews murder was the incest, and for Abby it was "you're not getting any of the Borden money". I think that the Borden family was one goofed up family.

But back then, that kind of stuff wasn't reported. The prevailing attitude was "what goes on behind close doors stays behind close doors and it's none of our business". I think it went on. Lizzie might have been afraid to say something or she was afraid of Andrew.